—— WHY SO MANY WORDS?

[dolf]

instances of temporal cohesion as time check ideas.
That the spoken word ought as integrity then follow a circular / elliptical
path: by that I mean if it runs long enough then it ought to cohere along
an equivalent head to tail path.
The DAO is metaphysical and therefore before / alongside / outside time."

I have no idea what you're referring to.
What chapter?
What are the five instances of temporal cohesion as time check ideas?

I keep aggregations of our dialog as chapters and I note therein that I
have five ideas which as spontaneity are associated to ideas derived from a
time check.

Thank you for your participation.

I've heard of Mobius and Klein
plus there's the uroborus.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Möbius_strip
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klein_bottle
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ouroboros
<< The ouroboros entered Western tradition via ancient Egyptian
iconography and the Greek magical tradition. It was adopted as a
symbol in Gnosticism and Hermeticism and most notably in alchemy.>>
With Taoist alchemy, especially Nei Tan, an infant appears again.
To return to a state of that of an infant, a newborn, one may.
A sacred embryo could be visualized, metaphysically, and then,
similar to yoga chakra wheels, vorticies, etc., energy may rise.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neidan
<< ... ... ultimately returning
to the primordial unity of the Tao, i.e., becoming an Immortal. >>
Wei Tan can be an other story.
http://www.philtar.ac.uk/encyclopedia/taoism/peng.html
<< On these island were believed to be plants that had the gift of
restoring life to the dead and renewing youth, mushrooms of
immortality (believed to be a species of Agaric), waters or wells of
life and life prolonging trees. Everyone that ate the mushrooms or the
fruit of P'eng-Lai renewed their youth and acquired the power of
floating from island to island. >>
States of consciousness, mystical experiences, paradigms
and such knots often vary from tail to tale telling time
for time beings in places within spaces naturally.
- thanks! Cheers!

direction and your goose is cooked ...
“The farther you go, the less you know.
Thus the sage knows without travelling;
He sees without looking;
He works without doing.” [Tao Te Ching - Lao Tzu - chapter 47]
And then you went on verbose tangents in an attempt to conceal that fact."
possible to act against the Dao?
I don't know what you are referring to."
don’t know why you use so many words…
<https://www.grapple369.com/?time:12.24>
    #373 as [#30, #70, #3, #70, #200] = lógos (G3056): {UMBRA: #373 % #41 =
#4} 1) of speech; 1a) a *WORD*, uttered by a living voice, embodies a
conception or idea; 1b) what someone has said; 1b1) a word; 1b2) the
sayings of God; 1b3) decree, mandate or order; 1b4) of the moral precepts
given by God; 1b5) Old Testament prophecy given by the prophets; 1b6) what
is declared, a thought, declaration, aphorism, a weighty saying, a dictum,
a maxim; 1c) discourse; 1c1) the act of speaking, speech; 1c2) the faculty
of speech, skill and practice in speaking; 1c3) a kind or style of
speaking; 1c4) a continuous speaking discourse - instruction; 1d) doctrine,
teaching; 1e) anything reported in speech; a narration, narrative; 1f)
matter under discussion, thing spoken of, affair, a matter in dispute,
case, suit at law; 1g) the thing spoken of or talked about; event, deed; 2)
*ITS* *USE* *AS* *RESPECT* *TO* *THE* *MIND* *ALONE*; 2a) reason, the
mental faculty of thinking, meditating, reasoning, calculating; 2b)
account, i.e. regard, consideration; 2c) account, i.e. reckoning, score;
2d) account, i.e. answer or explanation in reference to judgment; 2e)
relation, i.e. with whom as judge we stand in relation; 2e1) reason would;
2f) reason, cause, ground; 3) In John, denotes the essential Word of God,
Jesus Christ, the personal wisdom and power in union with God, his minister
in creation and government of the universe, the cause of all the world's
life both physical and ethical, which for the procurement of man's
salvation put on human nature in the person of Jesus the Messiah, the
second person in the Godhead, and shone forth conspicuously from His words
and deeds.;
Try number instead…
The suggestion given of the name DAO TE CHING conveys the changes necessary
to obtain the virtue (TE) of DAO."
what you're referring to.
Mixing and matching Romanizations occurs.
To obtain the De of Dao, or Teh of Tao, may suggest some body or individual
has lost Tao.
A virtue of being in the Zone is to experience wonder.
One may wonder, how does one arrive in, stay in, know
and be in the Zone and if such a state is possible forever.
How long is eternity.
How long does the present last.
Now is the time at all times now is.
A great gift, the present, unfolds.
To be an eternal, an immortal, with Tao Chia, is possible.
To not identify with mortality seeing as how duality suggests,
when mortality exists, not-mortality also exists. TTC 2 articulates.
Beyond being either/or
Prior to nonbeing both/and
Not-two, not-one, not any thing
Neither a non-thing nor nothing
The above batch of #373 appear to be like a dictionary of a sort.
Forgetting about words might be a technique.
Thinking without words is possible and perhaps common when being
spontaneous, prior to words emerging, naturally."
written my “so many words” statement before then doing a time check and in
hours."
    #316 as [#8, #6, #300, #2] / ?    #316 as [#8, #300, #2, #6] /
?    #365 as [#5, #8, #300, #2, #10, #600] / ?#310 as [#8, #300, #2] =
châshab (H2803): {UMBRA: #310 % #41 = #23} 1) to think, plan, esteem,
calculate, invent, make a judgment, imagine, count; 1a) (Qal); 1a1) to
think, account; 1a2) to plan, devise, mean; 1a3) to charge, impute, reckon;
1a4) to esteem, value, regard; 1a5) to invent; 1b) (Niphal); 1b1) to be
accounted, be thought, be esteemed; 1b2) to be computed, be reckoned; 1b3)
to be imputed; 1c) (Piel); 1c1) to think upon, consider, be mindful of;
1c2) *TO* *THINK* *TO* *DO*, *DEVISE*, *PLAN*; 1c3) to count, reckon; 1d)
(Hithpael) to be considered;
<https://www.grapple369.com/?time:12.24>
<https://www.grapple369.com/Groundwork/Daily%20Practice%20With%20The%20Dao.pdf>
Initial Post: 23 November 2021

--
YOUTUBE: "The Meerkat Circus"

SEE ALSO AS RELATIONSHIP: *INVALIDATING* {Perennial philosophy (HETEROS
{#390 - ROBBERS} v’s HOMOIOS {#391 - STEWARDS OF GOD’S HOUSE} THEORY OF
NUMBER) as universal of right and wrong...} *THE* *ORTHODOX* *AND* *ROMAN*
*CATHOLIC* *CHURCH'S* *CLAIM* {#390 as 1, #100, #80, #1, #3, #5, #200 as
harpax (G727): {#11 as #242} 1) rapacious, ravenous; 2) a extortioner, a
robber} *TO* *JUBILEE2000* *AS* *BEING* *DELUSIONAL* *AND* *FRAUDULENT*

Private Street on the edge of the Central Business District dated 16th May,
2000 - This report is prepared in response to a TP00/55 as a Notice of an
Application for Planning Permit

<http://www.grapple369.com/jubilee2000.html>

SEE ALSO: HYPOSTASIS AS DAO OF NATURE (Chinese: ZIRAN) / COURSE (Greek:
TROCHOS) OF NATURE (Greek: GENESIS) [James 3:6]

Chinese HAN Dynasty (206 BCE - 220CE) Hexagon Trigrams to Tetragram
assignments proposed by Yang Hsiung (53BCE - 18CE) which by 4BCE
(translation published within English as first European language in 1993),
first appeared in draft form as a meta-thesis titled T'AI HSUAN CHING {ie.
Canon of Supreme Mystery} on Natural Divination associated with the theory
of number, annual seasonal chronology and astrology reliant upon the seven
visible planets as cosmological mother image and the zodiac.

It shows the ZIRAN as the DAO of NATURE / COURSE-trochos OF NATURE-genesis
[James 3:6] as HYPOSTASIS comprising #81 trinomial tetragrammaton x 4.5 day
= #364.5 day / year as HOMOIOS THEORY OF NUMBER which is an amalgam of the
64 hexagrams as binomial trigrams / 81 as trinomial tetragrammaton rather
than its encapsulated contrived use as the microcosm to redefine the
macrocosm as the quintessence of the Pythagorean [Babylonian] as binomial
canon of transposition as HETEROS THEORY OF NUMBER.

<http://www.grapple369.com/nature.html>

The Charter of Human Rights and Responsibilities No. 43 of Act 2006 defines
a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING” and the question is, if it is permissible to
extend this definition to be a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING AS A CONSCIOUS
REALITY OF HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] WHO IS INSTANTIATED WITHIN THE TEMPORAL
REALITY AS THEN THE CAUSE FOR REASONING AND RATIONALITY."

That my mathematical theoretical noumenon defines the meta-descriptor
prototypes which are prerequisite to the BEING of HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] as
EXISTENCE / *OUSIA*.

<http://www.grapple369.com/Grumble.zip> (Download resources)

After all the ENNEAD of THOTH and not the Roman Catholic Eucharist,
expresses an Anthropic Cosmological Principle which appears within its
geometric conception as being equivalent to the Pythagorean
TETRAD/TETRACTYS.

[dolf]

You sometimes make insightful comments and if I aggregate them with my own
conceptions on the subject it accords me a comprehensive syncretic
progression of the topic.

One seldom finds on Usenet persons who are focusing on the topic rather
than personal attacks

Post by dolf

instances of temporal cohesion as time check ideas.
That the spoken word ought as integrity then follow a circular / elliptical
path: by that I mean if it runs long enough then it ought to cohere along
an equivalent head to tail path.
The DAO is metaphysical and therefore before / alongside / outside time."

I have no idea what you're referring to.
What chapter?
What are the five instances of temporal cohesion as time check ideas?

I keep aggregations of our dialog as chapters and I note therein that I
have five ideas which as spontaneity are associated to ideas derived from a
time check.
Thank you for your participation.

I've heard of Mobius and Klein
plus there's the uroborus.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Möbius_strip
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klein_bottle
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ouroboros
<< The ouroboros entered Western tradition via ancient Egyptian
iconography and the Greek magical tradition. It was adopted as a
symbol in Gnosticism and Hermeticism and most notably in alchemy.>>
With Taoist alchemy, especially Nei Tan, an infant appears again.
To return to a state of that of an infant, a newborn, one may.
A sacred embryo could be visualized, metaphysically, and then,
similar to yoga chakra wheels, vorticies, etc., energy may rise.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neidan
<< ... ... ultimately returning
to the primordial unity of the Tao, i.e., becoming an Immortal. >>
Wei Tan can be an other story.
http://www.philtar.ac.uk/encyclopedia/taoism/peng.html
<< On these island were believed to be plants that had the gift of
restoring life to the dead and renewing youth, mushrooms of
immortality (believed to be a species of Agaric), waters or wells of
life and life prolonging trees. Everyone that ate the mushrooms or the
fruit of P'eng-Lai renewed their youth and acquired the power of
floating from island to island. >>
States of consciousness, mystical experiences, paradigms
and such knots often vary from tail to tale telling time
for time beings in places within spaces naturally.
- thanks! Cheers!

direction and your goose is cooked ...
“The farther you go, the less you know.
Thus the sage knows without travelling;
He sees without looking;
He works without doing.” [Tao Te Ching - Lao Tzu - chapter 47]
And then you went on verbose tangents in an attempt to conceal that fact."
possible to act against the Dao?
I don't know what you are referring to."
don’t know why you use so many words…
<https://www.grapple369.com/?time:12.24>
    #373 as [#30, #70, #3, #70, #200] = lógos (G3056): {UMBRA: #373 % #41 =
#4} 1) of speech; 1a) a *WORD*, uttered by a living voice, embodies a
conception or idea; 1b) what someone has said; 1b1) a word; 1b2) the
sayings of God; 1b3) decree, mandate or order; 1b4) of the moral precepts
given by God; 1b5) Old Testament prophecy given by the prophets; 1b6) what
is declared, a thought, declaration, aphorism, a weighty saying, a dictum,
a maxim; 1c) discourse; 1c1) the act of speaking, speech; 1c2) the faculty
of speech, skill and practice in speaking; 1c3) a kind or style of
speaking; 1c4) a continuous speaking discourse - instruction; 1d) doctrine,
teaching; 1e) anything reported in speech; a narration, narrative; 1f)
matter under discussion, thing spoken of, affair, a matter in dispute,
case, suit at law; 1g) the thing spoken of or talked about; event, deed; 2)
*ITS* *USE* *AS* *RESPECT* *TO* *THE* *MIND* *ALONE*; 2a) reason, the
mental faculty of thinking, meditating, reasoning, calculating; 2b)
account, i.e. regard, consideration; 2c) account, i.e. reckoning, score;
2d) account, i.e. answer or explanation in reference to judgment; 2e)
relation, i.e. with whom as judge we stand in relation; 2e1) reason would;
2f) reason, cause, ground; 3) In John, denotes the essential Word of God,
Jesus Christ, the personal wisdom and power in union with God, his minister
in creation and government of the universe, the cause of all the world's
life both physical and ethical, which for the procurement of man's
salvation put on human nature in the person of Jesus the Messiah, the
second person in the Godhead, and shone forth conspicuously from His words
and deeds.;
Try number instead…
The suggestion given of the name DAO TE CHING conveys the changes necessary
to obtain the virtue (TE) of DAO."
what you're referring to.
Mixing and matching Romanizations occurs.
To obtain the De of Dao, or Teh of Tao, may suggest some body or individual
has lost Tao.
A virtue of being in the Zone is to experience wonder.
One may wonder, how does one arrive in, stay in, know
and be in the Zone and if such a state is possible forever.
How long is eternity.
How long does the present last.
Now is the time at all times now is.
A great gift, the present, unfolds.
To be an eternal, an immortal, with Tao Chia, is possible.
To not identify with mortality seeing as how duality suggests,
when mortality exists, not-mortality also exists. TTC 2 articulates.
Beyond being either/or
Prior to nonbeing both/and
Not-two, not-one, not any thing
Neither a non-thing nor nothing
The above batch of #373 appear to be like a dictionary of a sort.
Forgetting about words might be a technique.
Thinking without words is possible and perhaps common when being
spontaneous, prior to words emerging, naturally."
written my “so many words” statement before then doing a time check and in
hours."
    #316 as [#8, #6, #300, #2] / ?    #316 as [#8, #300, #2, #6] /
?    #365 as [#5, #8, #300, #2, #10, #600] / ?#310 as [#8, #300, #2] =
châshab (H2803): {UMBRA: #310 % #41 = #23} 1) to think, plan, esteem,
calculate, invent, make a judgment, imagine, count; 1a) (Qal); 1a1) to
think, account; 1a2) to plan, devise, mean; 1a3) to charge, impute, reckon;
1a4) to esteem, value, regard; 1a5) to invent; 1b) (Niphal); 1b1) to be
accounted, be thought, be esteemed; 1b2) to be computed, be reckoned; 1b3)
to be imputed; 1c) (Piel); 1c1) to think upon, consider, be mindful of;
1c2) *TO* *THINK* *TO* *DO*, *DEVISE*, *PLAN*; 1c3) to count, reckon; 1d)
(Hithpael) to be considered;
<https://www.grapple369.com/?time:12.24>
<https://www.grapple369.com/Groundwork/Daily%20Practice%20With%20The%20Dao.pdf>
Initial Post: 23 November 2021

--
YOUTUBE: "The Meerkat Circus"

http://youtu.be/H-7OuqWi4vQ

SEE ALSO AS RELATIONSHIP: *INVALIDATING* {Perennial philosophy (HETEROS
{#390 - ROBBERS} v’s HOMOIOS {#391 - STEWARDS OF GOD’S HOUSE} THEORY OF
NUMBER) as universal of right and wrong...} *THE* *ORTHODOX* *AND* *ROMAN*
*CATHOLIC* *CHURCH'S* *CLAIM* {#390 as 1, #100, #80, #1, #3, #5, #200 as
harpax (G727): {#11 as #242} 1) rapacious, ravenous; 2) a extortioner, a
robber} *TO* *JUBILEE2000* *AS* *BEING* *DELUSIONAL* *AND* *FRAUDULENT*

Private Street on the edge of the Central Business District dated 16th May,
2000 - This report is prepared in response to a TP00/55 as a Notice of an
Application for Planning Permit

<http://www.grapple369.com/jubilee2000.html>

SEE ALSO: HYPOSTASIS AS DAO OF NATURE (Chinese: ZIRAN) / COURSE (Greek:
TROCHOS) OF NATURE (Greek: GENESIS) [James 3:6]

Chinese HAN Dynasty (206 BCE - 220CE) Hexagon Trigrams to Tetragram
assignments proposed by Yang Hsiung (53BCE - 18CE) which by 4BCE
(translation published within English as first European language in 1993),
first appeared in draft form as a meta-thesis titled T'AI HSUAN CHING {ie.
Canon of Supreme Mystery} on Natural Divination associated with the theory
of number, annual seasonal chronology and astrology reliant upon the seven
visible planets as cosmological mother image and the zodiac.

It shows the ZIRAN as the DAO of NATURE / COURSE-trochos OF NATURE-genesis
[James 3:6] as HYPOSTASIS comprising #81 trinomial tetragrammaton x 4.5 day
= #364.5 day / year as HOMOIOS THEORY OF NUMBER which is an amalgam of the
64 hexagrams as binomial trigrams / 81 as trinomial tetragrammaton rather
than its encapsulated contrived use as the microcosm to redefine the
macrocosm as the quintessence of the Pythagorean [Babylonian] as binomial
canon of transposition as HETEROS THEORY OF NUMBER.

<http://www.grapple369.com/nature.html>

The Charter of Human Rights and Responsibilities No. 43 of Act 2006 defines
a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING” and the question is, if it is permissible to
extend this definition to be a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING AS A CONSCIOUS
REALITY OF HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] WHO IS INSTANTIATED WITHIN THE TEMPORAL
REALITY AS THEN THE CAUSE FOR REASONING AND RATIONALITY."

That my mathematical theoretical noumenon defines the meta-descriptor
prototypes which are prerequisite to the BEING of HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] as
EXISTENCE / *OUSIA*.

<http://www.grapple369.com/Grumble.zip> (Download resources)

After all the ENNEAD of THOTH and not the Roman Catholic Eucharist,
expresses an Anthropic Cosmological Principle which appears within its
geometric conception as being equivalent to the Pythagorean
TETRAD/TETRACTYS.

[dolf]

Post by dolf
You sometimes make insightful comments and if I aggregate them with my own
conceptions on the subject it accords me a comprehensive syncretic
progression of the topic.

Tao Chia has interested me since late 1996
after exploring newsgroups for a second time.
In the early 1990s,
there wasn't any group
that captured my attention.

Post by dolf
One seldom finds on Usenet persons who are focusing on the topic rather
than personal attacks

Flames are a common Usenet phenomenon.
In fact, here, in this bamboo grove, there was
upon my arrival a poster who held a position
such that Tao was G-d and was criticized
without remorse to an absurd degree.
At first, being somewhat of a perennialist, eclectic,
syncretistic thinker of mystical states myself, to understand
what the problem was, was difficult for me until differences
were explained to a point where the fog lifted.
Seeing everyone as assumed to be saying the same sort
of neoplatonic idea, in a mystical fog, is not uncommon.
With some paradigms, every one and all things are
God as a given such as pantheism.
With Taoism, gods are okay and even a Supreme Being,
the Supreme Lord on High, Shang Ti, or simply Ti, for short,
is an interpretation of TTC 4, except Tao is prior to Ti.
https://terebess.hu/english/tao/gia.html#Kap04
Of note is how in Jane English's revision of the Feng-English
version the word, gods, is changed to emperors.

The notion of gods v’s emperor is probably due to to the emperor being the
“son of heaven” or the “Lord of Man”

Interpretations of a word, a name, may vary
as perhaps is suggested by TTC 1.2.a.b.
http://www.mobilewords.pro/Tao/chap04.htm#top
Sentence 5 at the above mobilewords.pro site
appears to have a term seen as Lord or God a lot.
Hatcher's matrix uses the pinyin di aka Di for Ti
in the final line of DDJ 4.
https://alidark.files.wordpress.com/2010/09/laozib1.pdf
Dao appears to be fluid (04a) if not neutral or compliant,
similar to water metaphorically and to wonder if Dao
had a source or who or what its mother was, was
by an author of a saying or a sayer of one when
before writing an oral tradition was said to be.
DDJ 4 may suggest Dao is in all things
as the words, wan-wu, the 10k, appears.
The Feng-English TTC 4 has Tao
as the source of ten thousand things.
A seeker seeking consistency might be curious
about the source of wan-wu. Is the source, Three.
Is the source, Being. Is the speaker/writer neoplatonic.
Given ancient thought in the region, an organic view,
a world-view where tzu-jan/ziran is seen organically as
natural, things are born, three is, two is, one is, and
to presume Tao is the child as well could have bins.
In various TTC verses, the source varies.
In TTC 4, Tao is the source. In TTC 1, the nameless
wu-ming, is the beginning of heaven and earth given
the Feng-English interpretation. Yu-ming is the mother.
And, in TTC 1, the two, be they wu-ming and yu-ming
or mystery and manifestation, are sides of a unity, prehaps.
Xuan or xuan-xuan could be called, the Source.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xuanxue
Neidan may be an art if not a physical science.
Inner alchemical formulas vary among paradigms.

Post by dolf

Post by dolf

instances of temporal cohesion as time check ideas.
That the spoken word ought as integrity then follow a circular / elliptical
path: by that I mean if it runs long enough then it ought to cohere along
an equivalent head to tail path.
The DAO is metaphysical and therefore before / alongside / outside time."

I have no idea what you're referring to.
What chapter?
What are the five instances of temporal cohesion as time check ideas?

I keep aggregations of our dialog as chapters and I note therein that I
have five ideas which as spontaneity are associated to ideas derived from a
time check.
Thank you for your participation.

This newsgroup is a source and at times the Source
of many wonders, especially Tao Chia ones, at times,
usually a round three in the morning unless four later on.
https://terebess.hu/english/chuangtzu.html
<< What is acceptable we call acceptable; what is unacceptable we call
unacceptable. A road is made by people walking on it; things are so
because they are called so. What makes them so? Making them so makes
them so. What makes them not so? Making them not so makes them not so.
Things all must have that which is so; things all must have that which
is acceptable. There is nothing that is not so, nothing that is not
acceptable.
For this reason, whether you point to a little stalk or a great
pillar, a leper or the beautiful Hsi-shih, things ribald and shady or
things grotesque and strange, the Way makes them all into one. Their
dividedness is their completeness; their complete­ness is their
impairment. No thing is either complete or impaired, but all are made
into one again. Only the man of far­ reaching vision knows how to make
them into one. So he has no use [for categories], but relegates all to
the constant. The constant is the useful; the useful is the passable;
the passable is the successful; and with success, all is accomplished.
He relies upon this alone, relies upon it and does not know he is
doing so. This is called the Way.
But to wear out your brain trying to make things into one without
realizing that they are all the same - this is called "three in the
morning." What do I mean by "three in the morning"? When the monkey
trainer was handing out acorns, he said, "You get three in the morning
and four at night." This made all the monkeys furious. "Well, then,"
he said, "you get four in the morning and three at night." The monkeys
were all delighted. There was no change in the reality behind the
words, and yet the monkeys responded with joy and anger. Let them, if
they want to. So the sage harmonizes with both right and wrong and
rests in Heaven the Equalizer. This is called walking two roads.>>
Having many paradigms, for me, is akin to having a tool chest
full of treasures buried among the ten thou sand things.
<< The understanding of the men of ancient times went a long way. How
far did it go? To the point where some of them believed that things
have never existed - so far, to the end, where nothing can be added.
Those at the next stage thought that things exist but recognized no
boundaries among them. Those at the next stage thought there were
boundaries but recognized no right and wrong. Because right and wrong
appeared, the Way was injured, and because the Way was injured, love
became complete. But do such things as completion and injury really
exist, or do they not? >>
- fun stuff, imo, a regular hobby horse a round. Thanks! Cheers!

Post by dolf

Post by dolf

I've heard of Mobius and Klein
plus there's the uroborus.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Möbius_strip
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klein_bottle
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ouroboros
<< The ouroboros entered Western tradition via ancient Egyptian
iconography and the Greek magical tradition. It was adopted as a
symbol in Gnosticism and Hermeticism and most notably in alchemy.>>
With Taoist alchemy, especially Nei Tan, an infant appears again.
To return to a state of that of an infant, a newborn, one may.
A sacred embryo could be visualized, metaphysically, and then,
similar to yoga chakra wheels, vorticies, etc., energy may rise.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neidan
<< ... ... ultimately returning
to the primordial unity of the Tao, i.e., becoming an Immortal. >>
Wei Tan can be an other story.
http://www.philtar.ac.uk/encyclopedia/taoism/peng.html
<< On these island were believed to be plants that had the gift of
restoring life to the dead and renewing youth, mushrooms of
immortality (believed to be a species of Agaric), waters or wells of
life and life prolonging trees. Everyone that ate the mushrooms or the
fruit of P'eng-Lai renewed their youth and acquired the power of
floating from island to island. >>
States of consciousness, mystical experiences, paradigms
and such knots often vary from tail to tale telling time
for time beings in places within spaces naturally.
- thanks! Cheers!

direction and your goose is cooked ...
?The farther you go, the less you know.
Thus the sage knows without travelling;
He sees without looking;
He works without doing.? [Tao Te Ching - Lao Tzu - chapter 47]
And then you went on verbose tangents in an attempt to conceal that fact."
possible to act against the Dao?
I don't know what you are referring to."
don?t know why you use so many words?
<https://www.grapple369.com/?time:12.24>
    #373 as [#30, #70, #3, #70, #200] = lógos (G3056): {UMBRA: #373 % #41 =
#4} 1) of speech; 1a) a *WORD*, uttered by a living voice, embodies a
conception or idea; 1b) what someone has said; 1b1) a word; 1b2) the
sayings of God; 1b3) decree, mandate or order; 1b4) of the moral precepts
given by God; 1b5) Old Testament prophecy given by the prophets; 1b6) what
is declared, a thought, declaration, aphorism, a weighty saying, a dictum,
a maxim; 1c) discourse; 1c1) the act of speaking, speech; 1c2) the faculty
of speech, skill and practice in speaking; 1c3) a kind or style of
speaking; 1c4) a continuous speaking discourse - instruction; 1d) doctrine,
teaching; 1e) anything reported in speech; a narration, narrative; 1f)
matter under discussion, thing spoken of, affair, a matter in dispute,
case, suit at law; 1g) the thing spoken of or talked about; event, deed; 2)
*ITS* *USE* *AS* *RESPECT* *TO* *THE* *MIND* *ALONE*; 2a) reason, the
mental faculty of thinking, meditating, reasoning, calculating; 2b)
account, i.e. regard, consideration; 2c) account, i.e. reckoning, score;
2d) account, i.e. answer or explanation in reference to judgment; 2e)
relation, i.e. with whom as judge we stand in relation; 2e1) reason would;
2f) reason, cause, ground; 3) In John, denotes the essential Word of God,
Jesus Christ, the personal wisdom and power in union with God, his minister
in creation and government of the universe, the cause of all the world's
life both physical and ethical, which for the procurement of man's
salvation put on human nature in the person of Jesus the Messiah, the
second person in the Godhead, and shone forth conspicuously from His words
and deeds.;
Try number instead?
The suggestion given of the name DAO TE CHING conveys the changes necessary
to obtain the virtue (TE) of DAO."
what you're referring to.
Mixing and matching Romanizations occurs.
To obtain the De of Dao, or Teh of Tao, may suggest some body or individual
has lost Tao.
A virtue of being in the Zone is to experience wonder.
One may wonder, how does one arrive in, stay in, know
and be in the Zone and if such a state is possible forever.
How long is eternity.
How long does the present last.
Now is the time at all times now is.
A great gift, the present, unfolds.
To be an eternal, an immortal, with Tao Chia, is possible.
To not identify with mortality seeing as how duality suggests,
when mortality exists, not-mortality also exists. TTC 2 articulates.
Beyond being either/or
Prior to nonbeing both/and
Not-two, not-one, not any thing
Neither a non-thing nor nothing
The above batch of #373 appear to be like a dictionary of a sort.
Forgetting about words might be a technique.
Thinking without words is possible and perhaps common when being
spontaneous, prior to words emerging, naturally."
written my ?so many words? statement before then doing a time check and in
hours."
    #316 as [#8, #6, #300, #2] / ?    #316 as [#8, #300, #2, #6] /
?    #365 as [#5, #8, #300, #2, #10, #600] / ?#310 as [#8, #300, #2] =
châshab (H2803): {UMBRA: #310 % #41 = #23} 1) to think, plan, esteem,
calculate, invent, make a judgment, imagine, count; 1a) (Qal); 1a1) to
think, account; 1a2) to plan, devise, mean; 1a3) to charge, impute, reckon;
1a4) to esteem, value, regard; 1a5) to invent; 1b) (Niphal); 1b1) to be
accounted, be thought, be esteemed; 1b2) to be computed, be reckoned; 1b3)
to be imputed; 1c) (Piel); 1c1) to think upon, consider, be mindful of;
1c2) *TO* *THINK* *TO* *DO*, *DEVISE*, *PLAN*; 1c3) to count, reckon; 1d)
(Hithpael) to be considered;
<https://www.grapple369.com/?time:12.24>
<https://www.grapple369.com/Groundwork/Daily%20Practice%20With%20The%20Dao.pdf>
Initial Post: 23 November 2021

--
YOUTUBE: "The Meerkat Circus"

http://youtu.be/H-7OuqWi4vQ

SEE ALSO AS RELATIONSHIP: *INVALIDATING* {Perennial philosophy (HETEROS
{#390 - ROBBERS} v’s HOMOIOS {#391 - STEWARDS OF GOD’S HOUSE} THEORY OF
NUMBER) as universal of right and wrong...} *THE* *ORTHODOX* *AND* *ROMAN*
*CATHOLIC* *CHURCH'S* *CLAIM* {#390 as 1, #100, #80, #1, #3, #5, #200 as
harpax (G727): {#11 as #242} 1) rapacious, ravenous; 2) a extortioner, a
robber} *TO* *JUBILEE2000* *AS* *BEING* *DELUSIONAL* *AND* *FRAUDULENT*

Private Street on the edge of the Central Business District dated 16th May,
2000 - This report is prepared in response to a TP00/55 as a Notice of an
Application for Planning Permit

<http://www.grapple369.com/jubilee2000.html>

SEE ALSO: HYPOSTASIS AS DAO OF NATURE (Chinese: ZIRAN) / COURSE (Greek:
TROCHOS) OF NATURE (Greek: GENESIS) [James 3:6]

Chinese HAN Dynasty (206 BCE - 220CE) Hexagon Trigrams to Tetragram
assignments proposed by Yang Hsiung (53BCE - 18CE) which by 4BCE
(translation published within English as first European language in 1993),
first appeared in draft form as a meta-thesis titled T'AI HSUAN CHING {ie.
Canon of Supreme Mystery} on Natural Divination associated with the theory
of number, annual seasonal chronology and astrology reliant upon the seven
visible planets as cosmological mother image and the zodiac.

It shows the ZIRAN as the DAO of NATURE / COURSE-trochos OF NATURE-genesis
[James 3:6] as HYPOSTASIS comprising #81 trinomial tetragrammaton x 4.5 day
= #364.5 day / year as HOMOIOS THEORY OF NUMBER which is an amalgam of the
64 hexagrams as binomial trigrams / 81 as trinomial tetragrammaton rather
than its encapsulated contrived use as the microcosm to redefine the
macrocosm as the quintessence of the Pythagorean [Babylonian] as binomial
canon of transposition as HETEROS THEORY OF NUMBER.

<http://www.grapple369.com/nature.html>

The Charter of Human Rights and Responsibilities No. 43 of Act 2006 defines
a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING” and the question is, if it is permissible to
extend this definition to be a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING AS A CONSCIOUS
REALITY OF HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] WHO IS INSTANTIATED WITHIN THE TEMPORAL
REALITY AS THEN THE CAUSE FOR REASONING AND RATIONALITY."

That my mathematical theoretical noumenon defines the meta-descriptor
prototypes which are prerequisite to the BEING of HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] as
EXISTENCE / *OUSIA*.

<http://www.grapple369.com/Grumble.zip> (Download resources)

After all the ENNEAD of THOTH and not the Roman Catholic Eucharist,
expresses an Anthropic Cosmological Principle which appears within its
geometric conception as being equivalent to the Pythagorean
TETRAD/TETRACTYS.

[dolf]

You don’t seem to have the RICHARD LYNN translation of WANG BI’s commentary
on the I CHING / DAO TE CHING.

In my opinion such single entity literary opinion has merit.

The notion of gods v’s emperor is probably due to to the emperor being the
“son of heaven” or the “Lord of Man”

In any context, Tao is prior to Ti
or, using the pinyin, Dao preceeds Di, ontologically,
appearing to at least in a Lao Tzu's mind sigh.

At times in the TTC, an it appears to me to be
how given a swell foop entire paradigms are dealt with.
With Tao being prior to Ti, divinity can be forgotten.
As much as Te is seen as a big deal,
in TTC 38, it's put in a kind of perspective,
along with TTC 38's laundry list of other cards.
TTC 5 addresses Confucian jen/ren.
Hatcher translates as, "compassion(ate), humane(ity), kind(ness)."
TTC 48 discounts knowledge, learning, etc.
http://www.mobilewords.pro/Tao/chap48.htm#top
- translations/interpretations vary ... thanks again! Cheers!

--
YOUTUBE: "The Meerkat Circus"

http://youtu.be/H-7OuqWi4vQ

SEE ALSO AS RELATIONSHIP: *INVALIDATING* {Perennial philosophy (HETEROS
{#390 - ROBBERS} v’s HOMOIOS {#391 - STEWARDS OF GOD’S HOUSE} THEORY OF
NUMBER) as universal of right and wrong...} *THE* *ORTHODOX* *AND* *ROMAN*
*CATHOLIC* *CHURCH'S* *CLAIM* {#390 as 1, #100, #80, #1, #3, #5, #200 as
harpax (G727): {#11 as #242} 1) rapacious, ravenous; 2) a extortioner, a
robber} *TO* *JUBILEE2000* *AS* *BEING* *DELUSIONAL* *AND* *FRAUDULENT*

Private Street on the edge of the Central Business District dated 16th May,
2000 - This report is prepared in response to a TP00/55 as a Notice of an
Application for Planning Permit

<http://www.grapple369.com/jubilee2000.html>

SEE ALSO: HYPOSTASIS AS DAO OF NATURE (Chinese: ZIRAN) / COURSE (Greek:
TROCHOS) OF NATURE (Greek: GENESIS) [James 3:6]

Chinese HAN Dynasty (206 BCE - 220CE) Hexagon Trigrams to Tetragram
assignments proposed by Yang Hsiung (53BCE - 18CE) which by 4BCE
(translation published within English as first European language in 1993),
first appeared in draft form as a meta-thesis titled T'AI HSUAN CHING {ie.
Canon of Supreme Mystery} on Natural Divination associated with the theory
of number, annual seasonal chronology and astrology reliant upon the seven
visible planets as cosmological mother image and the zodiac.

It shows the ZIRAN as the DAO of NATURE / COURSE-trochos OF NATURE-genesis
[James 3:6] as HYPOSTASIS comprising #81 trinomial tetragrammaton x 4.5 day
= #364.5 day / year as HOMOIOS THEORY OF NUMBER which is an amalgam of the
64 hexagrams as binomial trigrams / 81 as trinomial tetragrammaton rather
than its encapsulated contrived use as the microcosm to redefine the
macrocosm as the quintessence of the Pythagorean [Babylonian] as binomial
canon of transposition as HETEROS THEORY OF NUMBER.

<http://www.grapple369.com/nature.html>

The Charter of Human Rights and Responsibilities No. 43 of Act 2006 defines
a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING” and the question is, if it is permissible to
extend this definition to be a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING AS A CONSCIOUS
REALITY OF HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] WHO IS INSTANTIATED WITHIN THE TEMPORAL
REALITY AS THEN THE CAUSE FOR REASONING AND RATIONALITY."

That my mathematical theoretical noumenon defines the meta-descriptor
prototypes which are prerequisite to the BEING of HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] as
EXISTENCE / *OUSIA*.

<http://www.grapple369.com/Grumble.zip> (Download resources)

After all the ENNEAD of THOTH and not the Roman Catholic Eucharist,
expresses an Anthropic Cosmological Principle which appears within its
geometric conception as being equivalent to the Pythagorean
TETRAD/TETRACTYS.

[dolf]

That ought to comprising…

I did find an expired / archive link to Richard Lynn’s translation to the
Tao Te Ching.

Which AYE has published.

That my reference is then Richard Lynn / Jane English translation with an
addition of the Canon of Supreme Mystery as the means for a unity of
apperception comprising Tao Te Ching, I Ching and Tetra from the supreme
mystery (4th plane as dominion mapping)/

Compromising the Tao Te Ching?
I don't understand what that means.
Aren't the Richard Lynn / Jane English versions, versions of the TTC?
Do you mean, comprising?
That would make sense to me.
- cheers!

SUPER: #467 / #78 - Recognizing Fidelity, Trust in Faith; I-Ching: H59 -
Dispersion, Dispersal (dissolution); Tetra: 47 - PATTERN (WEN),
EGO: #372 / #51 - Natural Guides and Nursing Virtuosity; I-Ching: H47 -
Oppression (exhaustion), Confining, Entangled; Tetra: 69 - EXHAUSTION
(CH'IUNG)]

You don?t seem to have the RICHARD LYNN translation of WANG BI?s commentary
on the I CHING / DAO TE CHING.

I don't recall seeing Richard Lynn's work.

In my opinion such single entity literary opinion has merit.

To seek for Richard Lynn is possible for me.
His translation of the Daodejing does not appear to be online.
A New Translation of the Tao-te ching of Laozi
as Interpreted by Wang Bi (Columbia University Press, 1999) >>
Curious, to me, is how various Romanizations occur
and appear when people mix and match the old Wade-Giles
and the newer pinyin spellings.
Lynn has Tao-te ching (Wade-Giles)
combined with Wang Bi (pinyin).
Wang Pi's version of the TTC tends to be the received one,
so-called, that is used by many, probably most, translators.
The I-Ching, aka Yijing is not of interest to me.
It appears to be an oracle of divination and would be
perhaps included in Taoist religion, aka Tao Chiao, how-
ever whether it happens to be in the Canon is unknown.

--
YOUTUBE: "The Meerkat Circus"

http://youtu.be/H-7OuqWi4vQ

SEE ALSO AS RELATIONSHIP: *INVALIDATING* {Perennial philosophy (HETEROS
{#390 - ROBBERS} v’s HOMOIOS {#391 - STEWARDS OF GOD’S HOUSE} THEORY OF
NUMBER) as universal of right and wrong...} *THE* *ORTHODOX* *AND* *ROMAN*
*CATHOLIC* *CHURCH'S* *CLAIM* {#390 as 1, #100, #80, #1, #3, #5, #200 as
harpax (G727): {#11 as #242} 1) rapacious, ravenous; 2) a extortioner, a
robber} *TO* *JUBILEE2000* *AS* *BEING* *DELUSIONAL* *AND* *FRAUDULENT*

Private Street on the edge of the Central Business District dated 16th May,
2000 - This report is prepared in response to a TP00/55 as a Notice of an
Application for Planning Permit

<http://www.grapple369.com/jubilee2000.html>

SEE ALSO: HYPOSTASIS AS DAO OF NATURE (Chinese: ZIRAN) / COURSE (Greek:
TROCHOS) OF NATURE (Greek: GENESIS) [James 3:6]

Chinese HAN Dynasty (206 BCE - 220CE) Hexagon Trigrams to Tetragram
assignments proposed by Yang Hsiung (53BCE - 18CE) which by 4BCE
(translation published within English as first European language in 1993),
first appeared in draft form as a meta-thesis titled T'AI HSUAN CHING {ie.
Canon of Supreme Mystery} on Natural Divination associated with the theory
of number, annual seasonal chronology and astrology reliant upon the seven
visible planets as cosmological mother image and the zodiac.

It shows the ZIRAN as the DAO of NATURE / COURSE-trochos OF NATURE-genesis
[James 3:6] as HYPOSTASIS comprising #81 trinomial tetragrammaton x 4.5 day
= #364.5 day / year as HOMOIOS THEORY OF NUMBER which is an amalgam of the
64 hexagrams as binomial trigrams / 81 as trinomial tetragrammaton rather
than its encapsulated contrived use as the microcosm to redefine the
macrocosm as the quintessence of the Pythagorean [Babylonian] as binomial
canon of transposition as HETEROS THEORY OF NUMBER.

<http://www.grapple369.com/nature.html>

The Charter of Human Rights and Responsibilities No. 43 of Act 2006 defines
a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING” and the question is, if it is permissible to
extend this definition to be a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING AS A CONSCIOUS
REALITY OF HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] WHO IS INSTANTIATED WITHIN THE TEMPORAL
REALITY AS THEN THE CAUSE FOR REASONING AND RATIONALITY."

That my mathematical theoretical noumenon defines the meta-descriptor
prototypes which are prerequisite to the BEING of HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] as
EXISTENCE / *OUSIA*.

<http://www.grapple369.com/Grumble.zip> (Download resources)

After all the ENNEAD of THOTH and not the Roman Catholic Eucharist,
expresses an Anthropic Cosmological Principle which appears within its
geometric conception as being equivalent to the Pythagorean
TETRAD/TETRACTYS.

[dolf]

The question I have is whether the Asian philosophers were ever regarded as
MAGI as likely to possess : gold, frankincense and myrrh

Especially given Lingbao Tianzun (靈寶天尊, "Lord of the Numinous Treasure") is
also known as the "Supreme Pure One" (Chinese: 上 清; pinyin: Shàngqīng) or
"The Universally Honoured One of Divinities and Treasures"

<< The Chinese historian Yu Ying-shi concludes that "as a general term,
fang-shih may be translated 'religious Taoists' or 'popular Taoists,' since
all such arts were later incorporated in the Taoist religion.

Only in specific cases depending on contexts, should the term be translated
'magicians,' 'alchemists,' or 'immortalists.'" Fangshi "is an elusive term
that defies a consistent translation" >>

<https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fangshi>

Found Lynn's version online!
https://terebess.hu/english/tao/Lynn.html

<< English version by Richard John Lynn, 2004 >>
<< The Classic of the Way and Virtue >>
Mention was made previously about a line in TTC 4.
<< I do not know whose child it could be,
for it appears to have been born before the Lord.>>
One may wonder, for Lynn, what does, the Lord,
refer to. Jesus? God? Shang Ti? Generic, the Lord?
Searching for Lynn's biography, a link was found.
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/354031865_Concepts_of_Self_and_Identity_in_the_Zhuangzi_New_Translations_of_Key_Passages_in_Selfhood_East_and_West_De-constructions_of_Identity_Selected_Papers_from_the_18th_Symposium_of_the_Academie_Du_Midi_Id
No idea how to make that a tiny URL.
<< In the Zhuangzi, all conscious dimensions of self are presented in
thoroughly negative terms and denounced as impediments to what it
regards as authentic self-realization: the attainment of
sage-hood or transformation into a “true” or “authentic” person,
a paradoxically self-transcendent, universal “self.” >>
- sounds apophatic! Thanks again! Cheers!

--
YOUTUBE: "The Meerkat Circus"

http://youtu.be/H-7OuqWi4vQ

SEE ALSO AS RELATIONSHIP: *INVALIDATING* {Perennial philosophy (HETEROS
{#390 - ROBBERS} v’s HOMOIOS {#391 - STEWARDS OF GOD’S HOUSE} THEORY OF
NUMBER) as universal of right and wrong...} *THE* *ORTHODOX* *AND* *ROMAN*
*CATHOLIC* *CHURCH'S* *CLAIM* {#390 as 1, #100, #80, #1, #3, #5, #200 as
harpax (G727): {#11 as #242} 1) rapacious, ravenous; 2) a extortioner, a
robber} *TO* *JUBILEE2000* *AS* *BEING* *DELUSIONAL* *AND* *FRAUDULENT*

Private Street on the edge of the Central Business District dated 16th May,
2000 - This report is prepared in response to a TP00/55 as a Notice of an
Application for Planning Permit

<http://www.grapple369.com/jubilee2000.html>

SEE ALSO: HYPOSTASIS AS DAO OF NATURE (Chinese: ZIRAN) / COURSE (Greek:
TROCHOS) OF NATURE (Greek: GENESIS) [James 3:6]

Chinese HAN Dynasty (206 BCE - 220CE) Hexagon Trigrams to Tetragram
assignments proposed by Yang Hsiung (53BCE - 18CE) which by 4BCE
(translation published within English as first European language in 1993),
first appeared in draft form as a meta-thesis titled T'AI HSUAN CHING {ie.
Canon of Supreme Mystery} on Natural Divination associated with the theory
of number, annual seasonal chronology and astrology reliant upon the seven
visible planets as cosmological mother image and the zodiac.

It shows the ZIRAN as the DAO of NATURE / COURSE-trochos OF NATURE-genesis
[James 3:6] as HYPOSTASIS comprising #81 trinomial tetragrammaton x 4.5 day
= #364.5 day / year as HOMOIOS THEORY OF NUMBER which is an amalgam of the
64 hexagrams as binomial trigrams / 81 as trinomial tetragrammaton rather
than its encapsulated contrived use as the microcosm to redefine the
macrocosm as the quintessence of the Pythagorean [Babylonian] as binomial
canon of transposition as HETEROS THEORY OF NUMBER.

<http://www.grapple369.com/nature.html>

The Charter of Human Rights and Responsibilities No. 43 of Act 2006 defines
a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING” and the question is, if it is permissible to
extend this definition to be a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING AS A CONSCIOUS
REALITY OF HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] WHO IS INSTANTIATED WITHIN THE TEMPORAL
REALITY AS THEN THE CAUSE FOR REASONING AND RATIONALITY."

That my mathematical theoretical noumenon defines the meta-descriptor
prototypes which are prerequisite to the BEING of HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] as
EXISTENCE / *OUSIA*.

<http://www.grapple369.com/Grumble.zip> (Download resources)

After all the ENNEAD of THOTH and not the Roman Catholic Eucharist,
expresses an Anthropic Cosmological Principle which appears within its
geometric conception as being equivalent to the Pythagorean
TETRAD/TETRACTYS.

[dolf]

Post by dolf
The question I have is whether the Asian philosophers were ever regarded as
MAGI as likely to possess : gold, frankincense and myrrh

<< In Chinese medicine, frankincense (Chinese: 乳香 rǔ xiāng) along with
myrrh (沒藥 mò yào) have anti-bacterial properties as well as blood-moving
uses. It can be used topically or orally, also used in surgical and
internal medicine of traditional Chinese medicine. >>

<https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frankincense>

Post by dolf
Especially given Lingbao Tianzun (靈寶天尊, "Lord of the Numinous Treasure") is
also known as the "Supreme Pure One" (Chinese: 上 清; pinyin: Shàngqīng) or
"The Universally Honoured One of Divinities and Treasures"
<< The Chinese historian Yu Ying-shi concludes that "as a general term,
fang-shih may be translated 'religious Taoists' or 'popular Taoists,' since
all such arts were later incorporated in the Taoist religion.
Only in specific cases depending on contexts, should the term be translated
'magicians,' 'alchemists,' or 'immortalists.'" Fangshi "is an elusive term
that defies a consistent translation" >>
<https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fangshi>

Found Lynn's version online!
https://terebess.hu/english/tao/Lynn.html

<< English version by Richard John Lynn, 2004 >>
<< The Classic of the Way and Virtue >>
Mention was made previously about a line in TTC 4.
<< I do not know whose child it could be,
for it appears to have been born before the Lord.>>
One may wonder, for Lynn, what does, the Lord,
refer to. Jesus? God? Shang Ti? Generic, the Lord?
Searching for Lynn's biography, a link was found.
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/354031865_Concepts_of_Self_and_Identity_in_the_Zhuangzi_New_Translations_of_Key_Passages_in_Selfhood_East_and_West_De-constructions_of_Identity_Selected_Papers_from_the_18th_Symposium_of_the_Academie_Du_Midi_Id
No idea how to make that a tiny URL.
<< In the Zhuangzi, all conscious dimensions of self are presented in
thoroughly negative terms and denounced as impediments to what it
regards as authentic self-realization: the attainment of
sage-hood or transformation into a “true” or “authentic” person,
a paradoxically self-transcendent, universal “self.” >>
- sounds apophatic! Thanks again! Cheers!

--
YOUTUBE: "The Meerkat Circus"

http://youtu.be/H-7OuqWi4vQ

SEE ALSO AS RELATIONSHIP: *INVALIDATING* {Perennial philosophy (HETEROS
{#390 - ROBBERS} v’s HOMOIOS {#391 - STEWARDS OF GOD’S HOUSE} THEORY OF
NUMBER) as universal of right and wrong...} *THE* *ORTHODOX* *AND* *ROMAN*
*CATHOLIC* *CHURCH'S* *CLAIM* {#390 as 1, #100, #80, #1, #3, #5, #200 as
harpax (G727): {#11 as #242} 1) rapacious, ravenous; 2) a extortioner, a
robber} *TO* *JUBILEE2000* *AS* *BEING* *DELUSIONAL* *AND* *FRAUDULENT*

Private Street on the edge of the Central Business District dated 16th May,
2000 - This report is prepared in response to a TP00/55 as a Notice of an
Application for Planning Permit

<http://www.grapple369.com/jubilee2000.html>

SEE ALSO: HYPOSTASIS AS DAO OF NATURE (Chinese: ZIRAN) / COURSE (Greek:
TROCHOS) OF NATURE (Greek: GENESIS) [James 3:6]

Chinese HAN Dynasty (206 BCE - 220CE) Hexagon Trigrams to Tetragram
assignments proposed by Yang Hsiung (53BCE - 18CE) which by 4BCE
(translation published within English as first European language in 1993),
first appeared in draft form as a meta-thesis titled T'AI HSUAN CHING {ie.
Canon of Supreme Mystery} on Natural Divination associated with the theory
of number, annual seasonal chronology and astrology reliant upon the seven
visible planets as cosmological mother image and the zodiac.

It shows the ZIRAN as the DAO of NATURE / COURSE-trochos OF NATURE-genesis
[James 3:6] as HYPOSTASIS comprising #81 trinomial tetragrammaton x 4.5 day
= #364.5 day / year as HOMOIOS THEORY OF NUMBER which is an amalgam of the
64 hexagrams as binomial trigrams / 81 as trinomial tetragrammaton rather
than its encapsulated contrived use as the microcosm to redefine the
macrocosm as the quintessence of the Pythagorean [Babylonian] as binomial
canon of transposition as HETEROS THEORY OF NUMBER.

<http://www.grapple369.com/nature.html>

The Charter of Human Rights and Responsibilities No. 43 of Act 2006 defines
a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING” and the question is, if it is permissible to
extend this definition to be a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING AS A CONSCIOUS
REALITY OF HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] WHO IS INSTANTIATED WITHIN THE TEMPORAL
REALITY AS THEN THE CAUSE FOR REASONING AND RATIONALITY."

That my mathematical theoretical noumenon defines the meta-descriptor
prototypes which are prerequisite to the BEING of HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] as
EXISTENCE / *OUSIA*.

<http://www.grapple369.com/Grumble.zip> (Download resources)

After all the ENNEAD of THOTH and not the Roman Catholic Eucharist,
expresses an Anthropic Cosmological Principle which appears within its
geometric conception as being equivalent to the Pythagorean
TETRAD/TETRACTYS.

[dolf]

Post by dolf
The question I have is whether the Asian philosophers were ever regarded as
MAGI as likely to possess : gold, frankincense and myrrh

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_Magi

That is the common accepted view, but my concern is whether given the
publication of the canon of supreme mystery by about 4 BCE whether there
are alternative views.

Much of the story is comprised of traditional belief but as we know of
false assertions about Sunday sacredness that the apostle Peter was still
observing Passover a decade later and could not possibly have interposed
Sunday observance as a Jew.

<< The term refers to the Persian priestly caste of Zoroastrianism. >>

Post by dolf
Especially given Lingbao Tianzun ("Lord of the Numinous Treasure") is
also known as the "Supreme Pure One" (Shàngqing) or
"The Universally Honoured One of Divinities and Treasures"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Pure_Ones
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lingbao_Tianzun
I'm not seeing a reference
specifically to gold, frankincense and myrrh.
The word, ever, as in, ever regarded, has potential.
Wai Tan, External Alchemy, included mercury in cinnabar.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waidan
Gold is mentioned at the above link.
I don't know anything about the other two
being used to change consciousness, philosophically,
metaphysically, or getting stoned along the Way.
http://www.itmonline.org/arts/myrrh.htm
<< In the Chinese medicine books, frankincense was first mentioned in
the Mingyi Bielu (Miscellaneous Records of Famous Physicians; ca. 500
A.D.). It was called fanhunxiang (calling back the soul fragrance) and
ruxiang (nipple-shaped fragrance); the latter name has been retained,
but the former is true to the original use of frankincense as incense
for mourning the dead. Myrrh, already known in China, entered the
formal herb books somewhat later, in the Kaibao Bencao (Materia Medica
of the Kaibao Era, 973 A.D.). Its name, moyao, indicates the medicine
(yao) of mo, the Chinese pronunciation of the Arabic name murr,
meaning bitter. In modern Chinese Materia Medica, these two resins are
classified as herbs for vitalizing circulation of blood and are
utilized for treating traumatic injury, painful swellings, masses, and
other disorders related to stasis syndromes. Their source remains the
Middle East, though frankincense trees have been cultivated in
southern China. >>
<< In these ancient times, myrrh had been used in Egypt for embalming
the bodies of Pharaohs, and frankincense had been used in India to
make incense for worship (in India, a related species of plant is
indigenous, though it produces an inferior product). Myrrh and
frankincense, traded throughout the Middle East at least since 1500
B.C., eventually came to China. There is mention of myrrh in a 4th
century (A.D.) Chinese book that is no longer existent but is quoted
directly in a later text. As in the Middle East, myrrh and
frankincense were used in China for making incense, and are so used
even today. But, in characteristic Chinese fashion of finding a
medicinal use for virtually everything, these herbs were soon employed
as medicines.>>
The Silk Road provided ample opportunity for trade.

Post by dolf
<< The Chinese historian Yu Ying-shi concludes that "as a general term,
fang-shih may be translated 'religious Taoists' or 'popular Taoists,' since
all such arts were later incorporated in the Taoist religion.
Only in specific cases depending on contexts, should the term be translated
'magicians,' 'alchemists,' or 'immortalists.'" Fangshi "is an elusive term
that defies a consistent translation" >>
<https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fangshi>

<< Joseph Needham traced the origins of Daoism to an alliance between
fangshi, wu "shamans; doctors" and philosophers such as Laozi and
At the heart of ancient Taoism there was an artisanal element, for
both the wizards and the philosophers were convinced that important
and useful things could be achieved by using one's hands. They did not
participate in the mentality of the Confucian scholar-administrator,
who sat on high in his tribunal issuing orders and never employing his
hands except in reading and writing. This is why it came about that
wherever in ancient China one finds the sprouts of any of the natural
sciences the Taoists are sure to be involved. The fang shih or
'gentlemen possessing magical recipes' were certainly Taoist, and they
worked in all kinds of directions as star-clerk and
weather-forecasters, men of farm-lore and wort-cunning, irrigators and
bridge-builders, architects and decorators, but above all alchemists.
Indeed the beginning of all alchemy rests with them if we define it,
as surely we should, as the combination of macrobiotics and
aurifaction.[36]
Needham defined his "carefully chosen" words: macrobiotics "the belief
that, with the aid of botany, zoology, mineralogy, and alchemy, it is
possible to prepare drugs or elixirs which will prolong life, giving
longevity (shou) or immortality (pu ssu)" and aurifaction "the belief
that it is possible to make gold from other quite different
substances, notably the ignoble metals".
Csikszentmihalyi summarizes Daoist-fangshi connections,
The "methods" of the fangshi may be seen as forerunners of organized
Taoist practices on several levels. In the Han, the concept of the Dao
served to explain the efficacy of the myriad of newly forming
disciplines, and many of these disciplines were the province of the
fangshi. This explains why the term daoshi (masters of the Dao) was
already beginning to replace the term fangshi in the Hanshu, resulting
in its gradual eclipse of the latter term. On a more concrete level,
many specific techniques of spirit transcendence, medicine, and
alchemy initially used by fangshi found their way
into later Taoist practice. >>
In the Chuang-tzu, shamanism is dealt with in a passage
when Lieh Tzu brought a shaman to his teacher, Hu Tzu.
The shaman did not fare well during the encounter.
I don't recall anything about the fangshi in Tao Chia
so-called Taoist Philosophy as contrasted with
Tao Chiao, Taoist Religion.
To say there was no difference in practice, some scholars do.
Ancient historians appear to have disagreed, coining jargon.
- interesting! Thanks!

--
YOUTUBE: "The Meerkat Circus"

http://youtu.be/H-7OuqWi4vQ

SEE ALSO AS RELATIONSHIP: *INVALIDATING* {Perennial philosophy (HETEROS
{#390 - ROBBERS} v’s HOMOIOS {#391 - STEWARDS OF GOD’S HOUSE} THEORY OF
NUMBER) as universal of right and wrong...} *THE* *ORTHODOX* *AND* *ROMAN*
*CATHOLIC* *CHURCH'S* *CLAIM* {#390 as 1, #100, #80, #1, #3, #5, #200 as
harpax (G727): {#11 as #242} 1) rapacious, ravenous; 2) a extortioner, a
robber} *TO* *JUBILEE2000* *AS* *BEING* *DELUSIONAL* *AND* *FRAUDULENT*

Private Street on the edge of the Central Business District dated 16th May,
2000 - This report is prepared in response to a TP00/55 as a Notice of an
Application for Planning Permit

<http://www.grapple369.com/jubilee2000.html>

SEE ALSO: HYPOSTASIS AS DAO OF NATURE (Chinese: ZIRAN) / COURSE (Greek:
TROCHOS) OF NATURE (Greek: GENESIS) [James 3:6]

Chinese HAN Dynasty (206 BCE - 220CE) Hexagon Trigrams to Tetragram
assignments proposed by Yang Hsiung (53BCE - 18CE) which by 4BCE
(translation published within English as first European language in 1993),
first appeared in draft form as a meta-thesis titled T'AI HSUAN CHING {ie.
Canon of Supreme Mystery} on Natural Divination associated with the theory
of number, annual seasonal chronology and astrology reliant upon the seven
visible planets as cosmological mother image and the zodiac.

It shows the ZIRAN as the DAO of NATURE / COURSE-trochos OF NATURE-genesis
[James 3:6] as HYPOSTASIS comprising #81 trinomial tetragrammaton x 4.5 day
= #364.5 day / year as HOMOIOS THEORY OF NUMBER which is an amalgam of the
64 hexagrams as binomial trigrams / 81 as trinomial tetragrammaton rather
than its encapsulated contrived use as the microcosm to redefine the
macrocosm as the quintessence of the Pythagorean [Babylonian] as binomial
canon of transposition as HETEROS THEORY OF NUMBER.

<http://www.grapple369.com/nature.html>

The Charter of Human Rights and Responsibilities No. 43 of Act 2006 defines
a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING” and the question is, if it is permissible to
extend this definition to be a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING AS A CONSCIOUS
REALITY OF HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] WHO IS INSTANTIATED WITHIN THE TEMPORAL
REALITY AS THEN THE CAUSE FOR REASONING AND RATIONALITY."

That my mathematical theoretical noumenon defines the meta-descriptor
prototypes which are prerequisite to the BEING of HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] as
EXISTENCE / *OUSIA*.

<http://www.grapple369.com/Grumble.zip> (Download resources)

After all the ENNEAD of THOTH and not the Roman Catholic Eucharist,
expresses an Anthropic Cosmological Principle which appears within its
geometric conception as being equivalent to the Pythagorean
TETRAD/TETRACTYS.

[dolf]

Thank you for clarifying the historical facts and answering my question.

Post by dolf
The question I have is whether the Asian philosophers were ever regarded as
MAGI as likely to possess : gold, frankincense and myrrh

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_Magi
<< The term refers to the Persian priestly caste of Zoroastrianism. >>

Post by dolf
Especially given Lingbao Tianzun ("Lord of the Numinous Treasure") is
also known as the "Supreme Pure One" (Shàngqing) or
"The Universally Honoured One of Divinities and Treasures"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Pure_Ones
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lingbao_Tianzun
I'm not seeing a reference
specifically to gold, frankincense and myrrh.
The word, ever, as in, ever regarded, has potential.
Wai Tan, External Alchemy, included mercury in cinnabar.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waidan
Gold is mentioned at the above link.
I don't know anything about the other two
being used to change consciousness, philosophically,
metaphysically, or getting stoned along the Way.
http://www.itmonline.org/arts/myrrh.htm
<< In the Chinese medicine books, frankincense was first mentioned in
the Mingyi Bielu (Miscellaneous Records of Famous Physicians; ca. 500
A.D.). It was called fanhunxiang (calling back the soul fragrance) and
ruxiang (nipple-shaped fragrance); the latter name has been retained,
but the former is true to the original use of frankincense as incense
for mourning the dead. Myrrh, already known in China, entered the
formal herb books somewhat later, in the Kaibao Bencao (Materia Medica
of the Kaibao Era, 973 A.D.). Its name, moyao, indicates the medicine
(yao) of mo, the Chinese pronunciation of the Arabic name murr,
meaning bitter. In modern Chinese Materia Medica, these two resins are
classified as herbs for vitalizing circulation of blood and are
utilized for treating traumatic injury, painful swellings, masses, and
other disorders related to stasis syndromes. Their source remains the
Middle East, though frankincense trees have been cultivated in
southern China. >>
<< In these ancient times, myrrh had been used in Egypt for embalming
the bodies of Pharaohs, and frankincense had been used in India to
make incense for worship (in India, a related species of plant is
indigenous, though it produces an inferior product). Myrrh and
frankincense, traded throughout the Middle East at least since 1500
B.C., eventually came to China. There is mention of myrrh in a 4th
century (A.D.) Chinese book that is no longer existent but is quoted
directly in a later text. As in the Middle East, myrrh and
frankincense were used in China for making incense, and are so used
even today. But, in characteristic Chinese fashion of finding a
medicinal use for virtually everything, these herbs were soon employed
as medicines.>>
The Silk Road provided ample opportunity for trade.

Post by dolf
<< The Chinese historian Yu Ying-shi concludes that "as a general term,
fang-shih may be translated 'religious Taoists' or 'popular Taoists,' since
all such arts were later incorporated in the Taoist religion.
Only in specific cases depending on contexts, should the term be translated
'magicians,' 'alchemists,' or 'immortalists.'" Fangshi "is an elusive term
that defies a consistent translation" >>
<https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fangshi>

<< Joseph Needham traced the origins of Daoism to an alliance between
fangshi, wu "shamans; doctors" and philosophers such as Laozi and
At the heart of ancient Taoism there was an artisanal element, for
both the wizards and the philosophers were convinced that important
and useful things could be achieved by using one's hands. They did not
participate in the mentality of the Confucian scholar-administrator,
who sat on high in his tribunal issuing orders and never employing his
hands except in reading and writing. This is why it came about that
wherever in ancient China one finds the sprouts of any of the natural
sciences the Taoists are sure to be involved. The fang shih or
'gentlemen possessing magical recipes' were certainly Taoist, and they
worked in all kinds of directions as star-clerk and
weather-forecasters, men of farm-lore and wort-cunning, irrigators and
bridge-builders, architects and decorators, but above all alchemists.
Indeed the beginning of all alchemy rests with them if we define it,
as surely we should, as the combination of macrobiotics and
aurifaction.[36]
Needham defined his "carefully chosen" words: macrobiotics "the belief
that, with the aid of botany, zoology, mineralogy, and alchemy, it is
possible to prepare drugs or elixirs which will prolong life, giving
longevity (shou) or immortality (pu ssu)" and aurifaction "the belief
that it is possible to make gold from other quite different
substances, notably the ignoble metals".
Csikszentmihalyi summarizes Daoist-fangshi connections,
The "methods" of the fangshi may be seen as forerunners of organized
Taoist practices on several levels. In the Han, the concept of the Dao
served to explain the efficacy of the myriad of newly forming
disciplines, and many of these disciplines were the province of the
fangshi. This explains why the term daoshi (masters of the Dao) was
already beginning to replace the term fangshi in the Hanshu, resulting
in its gradual eclipse of the latter term. On a more concrete level,
many specific techniques of spirit transcendence, medicine, and
alchemy initially used by fangshi found their way
into later Taoist practice. >>
In the Chuang-tzu, shamanism is dealt with in a passage
when Lieh Tzu brought a shaman to his teacher, Hu Tzu.
The shaman did not fare well during the encounter.
I don't recall anything about the fangshi in Tao Chia
so-called Taoist Philosophy as contrasted with
Tao Chiao, Taoist Religion.
To say there was no difference in practice, some scholars do.
Ancient historians appear to have disagreed, coining jargon.
- interesting! Thanks!

--
YOUTUBE: "The Meerkat Circus"

http://youtu.be/H-7OuqWi4vQ

SEE ALSO AS RELATIONSHIP: *INVALIDATING* {Perennial philosophy (HETEROS
{#390 - ROBBERS} v’s HOMOIOS {#391 - STEWARDS OF GOD’S HOUSE} THEORY OF
NUMBER) as universal of right and wrong...} *THE* *ORTHODOX* *AND* *ROMAN*
*CATHOLIC* *CHURCH'S* *CLAIM* {#390 as 1, #100, #80, #1, #3, #5, #200 as
harpax (G727): {#11 as #242} 1) rapacious, ravenous; 2) a extortioner, a
robber} *TO* *JUBILEE2000* *AS* *BEING* *DELUSIONAL* *AND* *FRAUDULENT*

Private Street on the edge of the Central Business District dated 16th May,
2000 - This report is prepared in response to a TP00/55 as a Notice of an
Application for Planning Permit

<http://www.grapple369.com/jubilee2000.html>

SEE ALSO: HYPOSTASIS AS DAO OF NATURE (Chinese: ZIRAN) / COURSE (Greek:
TROCHOS) OF NATURE (Greek: GENESIS) [James 3:6]

Chinese HAN Dynasty (206 BCE - 220CE) Hexagon Trigrams to Tetragram
assignments proposed by Yang Hsiung (53BCE - 18CE) which by 4BCE
(translation published within English as first European language in 1993),
first appeared in draft form as a meta-thesis titled T'AI HSUAN CHING {ie.
Canon of Supreme Mystery} on Natural Divination associated with the theory
of number, annual seasonal chronology and astrology reliant upon the seven
visible planets as cosmological mother image and the zodiac.

It shows the ZIRAN as the DAO of NATURE / COURSE-trochos OF NATURE-genesis
[James 3:6] as HYPOSTASIS comprising #81 trinomial tetragrammaton x 4.5 day
= #364.5 day / year as HOMOIOS THEORY OF NUMBER which is an amalgam of the
64 hexagrams as binomial trigrams / 81 as trinomial tetragrammaton rather
than its encapsulated contrived use as the microcosm to redefine the
macrocosm as the quintessence of the Pythagorean [Babylonian] as binomial
canon of transposition as HETEROS THEORY OF NUMBER.

<http://www.grapple369.com/nature.html>

The Charter of Human Rights and Responsibilities No. 43 of Act 2006 defines
a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING” and the question is, if it is permissible to
extend this definition to be a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING AS A CONSCIOUS
REALITY OF HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] WHO IS INSTANTIATED WITHIN THE TEMPORAL
REALITY AS THEN THE CAUSE FOR REASONING AND RATIONALITY."

That my mathematical theoretical noumenon defines the meta-descriptor
prototypes which are prerequisite to the BEING of HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] as
EXISTENCE / *OUSIA*.

<http://www.grapple369.com/Grumble.zip> (Download resources)

After all the ENNEAD of THOTH and not the Roman Catholic Eucharist,
expresses an Anthropic Cosmological Principle which appears within its
geometric conception as being equivalent to the Pythagorean
TETRAD/TETRACTYS.

[dolf]

Post by dolf
Thank you for clarifying the historical facts and answering my question.

I note that the Silk Road enable trade with Rome which is further west that
Jerusalem.

<< Silk Road, also called Silk Route, ancient trade route, linking China
with the West, that carried goods and ideas between the two great
civilizations of Rome and China. >>

<https://www.britannica.com/topic/Silk-Road-trade-route>

Post by dolf

Post by dolf
The question I have is whether the Asian philosophers were ever regarded as
MAGI as likely to possess : gold, frankincense and myrrh

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_Magi
<< The term refers to the Persian priestly caste of Zoroastrianism. >>

Post by dolf
Especially given Lingbao Tianzun ("Lord of the Numinous Treasure") is
also known as the "Supreme Pure One" (Shàngqing) or
"The Universally Honoured One of Divinities and Treasures"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Pure_Ones
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lingbao_Tianzun
I'm not seeing a reference
specifically to gold, frankincense and myrrh.
The word, ever, as in, ever regarded, has potential.
Wai Tan, External Alchemy, included mercury in cinnabar.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waidan
Gold is mentioned at the above link.
I don't know anything about the other two
being used to change consciousness, philosophically,
metaphysically, or getting stoned along the Way.
http://www.itmonline.org/arts/myrrh.htm
<< In the Chinese medicine books, frankincense was first mentioned in
the Mingyi Bielu (Miscellaneous Records of Famous Physicians; ca. 500
A.D.). It was called fanhunxiang (calling back the soul fragrance) and
ruxiang (nipple-shaped fragrance); the latter name has been retained,
but the former is true to the original use of frankincense as incense
for mourning the dead. Myrrh, already known in China, entered the
formal herb books somewhat later, in the Kaibao Bencao (Materia Medica
of the Kaibao Era, 973 A.D.). Its name, moyao, indicates the medicine
(yao) of mo, the Chinese pronunciation of the Arabic name murr,
meaning bitter. In modern Chinese Materia Medica, these two resins are
classified as herbs for vitalizing circulation of blood and are
utilized for treating traumatic injury, painful swellings, masses, and
other disorders related to stasis syndromes. Their source remains the
Middle East, though frankincense trees have been cultivated in
southern China. >>
<< In these ancient times, myrrh had been used in Egypt for embalming
the bodies of Pharaohs, and frankincense had been used in India to
make incense for worship (in India, a related species of plant is
indigenous, though it produces an inferior product). Myrrh and
frankincense, traded throughout the Middle East at least since 1500
B.C., eventually came to China. There is mention of myrrh in a 4th
century (A.D.) Chinese book that is no longer existent but is quoted
directly in a later text. As in the Middle East, myrrh and
frankincense were used in China for making incense, and are so used
even today. But, in characteristic Chinese fashion of finding a
medicinal use for virtually everything, these herbs were soon employed
as medicines.>>
The Silk Road provided ample opportunity for trade.

Post by dolf
<< The Chinese historian Yu Ying-shi concludes that "as a general term,
fang-shih may be translated 'religious Taoists' or 'popular Taoists,' since
all such arts were later incorporated in the Taoist religion.
Only in specific cases depending on contexts, should the term be translated
'magicians,' 'alchemists,' or 'immortalists.'" Fangshi "is an elusive term
that defies a consistent translation" >>
<https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fangshi>

<< Joseph Needham traced the origins of Daoism to an alliance between
fangshi, wu "shamans; doctors" and philosophers such as Laozi and
At the heart of ancient Taoism there was an artisanal element, for
both the wizards and the philosophers were convinced that important
and useful things could be achieved by using one's hands. They did not
participate in the mentality of the Confucian scholar-administrator,
who sat on high in his tribunal issuing orders and never employing his
hands except in reading and writing. This is why it came about that
wherever in ancient China one finds the sprouts of any of the natural
sciences the Taoists are sure to be involved. The fang shih or
'gentlemen possessing magical recipes' were certainly Taoist, and they
worked in all kinds of directions as star-clerk and
weather-forecasters, men of farm-lore and wort-cunning, irrigators and
bridge-builders, architects and decorators, but above all alchemists.
Indeed the beginning of all alchemy rests with them if we define it,
as surely we should, as the combination of macrobiotics and
aurifaction.[36]
Needham defined his "carefully chosen" words: macrobiotics "the belief
that, with the aid of botany, zoology, mineralogy, and alchemy, it is
possible to prepare drugs or elixirs which will prolong life, giving
longevity (shou) or immortality (pu ssu)" and aurifaction "the belief
that it is possible to make gold from other quite different
substances, notably the ignoble metals".
Csikszentmihalyi summarizes Daoist-fangshi connections,
The "methods" of the fangshi may be seen as forerunners of organized
Taoist practices on several levels. In the Han, the concept of the Dao
served to explain the efficacy of the myriad of newly forming
disciplines, and many of these disciplines were the province of the
fangshi. This explains why the term daoshi (masters of the Dao) was
already beginning to replace the term fangshi in the Hanshu, resulting
in its gradual eclipse of the latter term. On a more concrete level,
many specific techniques of spirit transcendence, medicine, and
alchemy initially used by fangshi found their way
into later Taoist practice. >>
In the Chuang-tzu, shamanism is dealt with in a passage
when Lieh Tzu brought a shaman to his teacher, Hu Tzu.
The shaman did not fare well during the encounter.
I don't recall anything about the fangshi in Tao Chia
so-called Taoist Philosophy as contrasted with
Tao Chiao, Taoist Religion.
To say there was no difference in practice, some scholars do.
Ancient historians appear to have disagreed, coining jargon.
- interesting! Thanks!

--
YOUTUBE: "The Meerkat Circus"

http://youtu.be/H-7OuqWi4vQ

SEE ALSO AS RELATIONSHIP: *INVALIDATING* {Perennial philosophy (HETEROS
{#390 - ROBBERS} v’s HOMOIOS {#391 - STEWARDS OF GOD’S HOUSE} THEORY OF
NUMBER) as universal of right and wrong...} *THE* *ORTHODOX* *AND* *ROMAN*
*CATHOLIC* *CHURCH'S* *CLAIM* {#390 as 1, #100, #80, #1, #3, #5, #200 as
harpax (G727): {#11 as #242} 1) rapacious, ravenous; 2) a extortioner, a
robber} *TO* *JUBILEE2000* *AS* *BEING* *DELUSIONAL* *AND* *FRAUDULENT*

Private Street on the edge of the Central Business District dated 16th May,
2000 - This report is prepared in response to a TP00/55 as a Notice of an
Application for Planning Permit

<http://www.grapple369.com/jubilee2000.html>

SEE ALSO: HYPOSTASIS AS DAO OF NATURE (Chinese: ZIRAN) / COURSE (Greek:
TROCHOS) OF NATURE (Greek: GENESIS) [James 3:6]

Chinese HAN Dynasty (206 BCE - 220CE) Hexagon Trigrams to Tetragram
assignments proposed by Yang Hsiung (53BCE - 18CE) which by 4BCE
(translation published within English as first European language in 1993),
first appeared in draft form as a meta-thesis titled T'AI HSUAN CHING {ie.
Canon of Supreme Mystery} on Natural Divination associated with the theory
of number, annual seasonal chronology and astrology reliant upon the seven
visible planets as cosmological mother image and the zodiac.

It shows the ZIRAN as the DAO of NATURE / COURSE-trochos OF NATURE-genesis
[James 3:6] as HYPOSTASIS comprising #81 trinomial tetragrammaton x 4.5 day
= #364.5 day / year as HOMOIOS THEORY OF NUMBER which is an amalgam of the
64 hexagrams as binomial trigrams / 81 as trinomial tetragrammaton rather
than its encapsulated contrived use as the microcosm to redefine the
macrocosm as the quintessence of the Pythagorean [Babylonian] as binomial
canon of transposition as HETEROS THEORY OF NUMBER.

<http://www.grapple369.com/nature.html>

The Charter of Human Rights and Responsibilities No. 43 of Act 2006 defines
a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING” and the question is, if it is permissible to
extend this definition to be a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING AS A CONSCIOUS
REALITY OF HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] WHO IS INSTANTIATED WITHIN THE TEMPORAL
REALITY AS THEN THE CAUSE FOR REASONING AND RATIONALITY."

That my mathematical theoretical noumenon defines the meta-descriptor
prototypes which are prerequisite to the BEING of HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] as
EXISTENCE / *OUSIA*.

<http://www.grapple369.com/Grumble.zip> (Download resources)

After all the ENNEAD of THOTH and not the Roman Catholic Eucharist,
expresses an Anthropic Cosmological Principle which appears within its
geometric conception as being equivalent to the Pythagorean
TETRAD/TETRACTYS.

[dolf]

Post by dolf
Thank you for clarifying the historical facts and answering my question.

I note that the Silk Road enabled trade with Rome which is further west
than Jerusalem.

<< Silk Road, also called Silk Route, ancient trade route, linking China
with the West, that carried goods and ideas between the two great
civilizations of Rome and China. >>

<https://www.britannica.com/topic/Silk-Road-trade-route>

Post by dolf

Post by dolf
The question I have is whether the Asian philosophers were ever regarded as
MAGI as likely to possess : gold, frankincense and myrrh

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_Magi
<< The term refers to the Persian priestly caste of Zoroastrianism. >>

Post by dolf
Especially given Lingbao Tianzun ("Lord of the Numinous Treasure") is
also known as the "Supreme Pure One" (Shàngqing) or
"The Universally Honoured One of Divinities and Treasures"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Pure_Ones
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lingbao_Tianzun
I'm not seeing a reference
specifically to gold, frankincense and myrrh.
The word, ever, as in, ever regarded, has potential.
Wai Tan, External Alchemy, included mercury in cinnabar.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waidan
Gold is mentioned at the above link.
I don't know anything about the other two
being used to change consciousness, philosophically,
metaphysically, or getting stoned along the Way.
http://www.itmonline.org/arts/myrrh.htm
<< In the Chinese medicine books, frankincense was first mentioned in
the Mingyi Bielu (Miscellaneous Records of Famous Physicians; ca. 500
A.D.). It was called fanhunxiang (calling back the soul fragrance) and
ruxiang (nipple-shaped fragrance); the latter name has been retained,
but the former is true to the original use of frankincense as incense
for mourning the dead. Myrrh, already known in China, entered the
formal herb books somewhat later, in the Kaibao Bencao (Materia Medica
of the Kaibao Era, 973 A.D.). Its name, moyao, indicates the medicine
(yao) of mo, the Chinese pronunciation of the Arabic name murr,
meaning bitter. In modern Chinese Materia Medica, these two resins are
classified as herbs for vitalizing circulation of blood and are
utilized for treating traumatic injury, painful swellings, masses, and
other disorders related to stasis syndromes. Their source remains the
Middle East, though frankincense trees have been cultivated in
southern China. >>
<< In these ancient times, myrrh had been used in Egypt for embalming
the bodies of Pharaohs, and frankincense had been used in India to
make incense for worship (in India, a related species of plant is
indigenous, though it produces an inferior product). Myrrh and
frankincense, traded throughout the Middle East at least since 1500
B.C., eventually came to China. There is mention of myrrh in a 4th
century (A.D.) Chinese book that is no longer existent but is quoted
directly in a later text. As in the Middle East, myrrh and
frankincense were used in China for making incense, and are so used
even today. But, in characteristic Chinese fashion of finding a
medicinal use for virtually everything, these herbs were soon employed
as medicines.>>
The Silk Road provided ample opportunity for trade.

Post by dolf
<< The Chinese historian Yu Ying-shi concludes that "as a general term,
fang-shih may be translated 'religious Taoists' or 'popular Taoists,' since
all such arts were later incorporated in the Taoist religion.
Only in specific cases depending on contexts, should the term be translated
'magicians,' 'alchemists,' or 'immortalists.'" Fangshi "is an elusive term
that defies a consistent translation" >>
<https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fangshi>

<< Joseph Needham traced the origins of Daoism to an alliance between
fangshi, wu "shamans; doctors" and philosophers such as Laozi and
At the heart of ancient Taoism there was an artisanal element, for
both the wizards and the philosophers were convinced that important
and useful things could be achieved by using one's hands. They did not
participate in the mentality of the Confucian scholar-administrator,
who sat on high in his tribunal issuing orders and never employing his
hands except in reading and writing. This is why it came about that
wherever in ancient China one finds the sprouts of any of the natural
sciences the Taoists are sure to be involved. The fang shih or
'gentlemen possessing magical recipes' were certainly Taoist, and they
worked in all kinds of directions as star-clerk and
weather-forecasters, men of farm-lore and wort-cunning, irrigators and
bridge-builders, architects and decorators, but above all alchemists.
Indeed the beginning of all alchemy rests with them if we define it,
as surely we should, as the combination of macrobiotics and
aurifaction.[36]
Needham defined his "carefully chosen" words: macrobiotics "the belief
that, with the aid of botany, zoology, mineralogy, and alchemy, it is
possible to prepare drugs or elixirs which will prolong life, giving
longevity (shou) or immortality (pu ssu)" and aurifaction "the belief
that it is possible to make gold from other quite different
substances, notably the ignoble metals".
Csikszentmihalyi summarizes Daoist-fangshi connections,
The "methods" of the fangshi may be seen as forerunners of organized
Taoist practices on several levels. In the Han, the concept of the Dao
served to explain the efficacy of the myriad of newly forming
disciplines, and many of these disciplines were the province of the
fangshi. This explains why the term daoshi (masters of the Dao) was
already beginning to replace the term fangshi in the Hanshu, resulting
in its gradual eclipse of the latter term. On a more concrete level,
many specific techniques of spirit transcendence, medicine, and
alchemy initially used by fangshi found their way
into later Taoist practice. >>
In the Chuang-tzu, shamanism is dealt with in a passage
when Lieh Tzu brought a shaman to his teacher, Hu Tzu.
The shaman did not fare well during the encounter.
I don't recall anything about the fangshi in Tao Chia
so-called Taoist Philosophy as contrasted with
Tao Chiao, Taoist Religion.
To say there was no difference in practice, some scholars do.
Ancient historians appear to have disagreed, coining jargon.
- interesting! Thanks!

--
YOUTUBE: "The Meerkat Circus"

http://youtu.be/H-7OuqWi4vQ

SEE ALSO AS RELATIONSHIP: *INVALIDATING* {Perennial philosophy (HETEROS
{#390 - ROBBERS} v’s HOMOIOS {#391 - STEWARDS OF GOD’S HOUSE} THEORY OF
NUMBER) as universal of right and wrong...} *THE* *ORTHODOX* *AND*
*ROMAN* *CATHOLIC* *CHURCH'S* *CLAIM* {#390 as 1, #100, #80, #1, #3, #5,
#200 as harpax (G727): {#11 as #242} 1) rapacious, ravenous; 2) a
extortioner, a robber} *TO* *JUBILEE2000* *AS* *BEING* *DELUSIONAL*
*AND* *FRAUDULENT*

Private Street on the edge of the Central Business District dated 16th
May, 2000 - This report is prepared in response to a TP00/55 as a Notice
of an Application for Planning Permit

<http://www.grapple369.com/jubilee2000.html>

SEE ALSO: HYPOSTASIS AS DAO OF NATURE (Chinese: ZIRAN) / COURSE (Greek:
TROCHOS) OF NATURE (Greek: GENESIS) [James 3:6]

Chinese HAN Dynasty (206 BCE - 220CE) Hexagon Trigrams to Tetragram
assignments proposed by Yang Hsiung (53BCE - 18CE) which by 4BCE
(translation published within English as first European language in
1993), first appeared in draft form as a meta-thesis titled T'AI HSUAN
CHING {ie. Canon of Supreme Mystery} on Natural Divination associated
with the theory of number, annual seasonal chronology and astrology
reliant upon the seven visible planets as cosmological mother image and
the zodiac.

It shows the ZIRAN as the DAO of NATURE / COURSE-trochos OF
NATURE-genesis [James 3:6] as HYPOSTASIS comprising #81 trinomial
tetragrammaton x 4.5 day = #364.5 day / year as HOMOIOS THEORY OF NUMBER
which is an amalgam of the 64 hexagrams as binomial trigrams / 81 as
trinomial tetragrammaton rather than its encapsulated contrived use as
the microcosm to redefine the macrocosm as the quintessence of the
Pythagorean [Babylonian] as binomial canon of transposition as HETEROS
THEORY OF NUMBER.

<http://www.grapple369.com/nature.html>

The Charter of Human Rights and Responsibilities No. 43 of Act 2006
defines a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING” and the question is, if it is
permissible to extend this definition to be a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN
BEING AS A CONSCIOUS REALITY OF HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] WHO IS INSTANTIATED
WITHIN THE TEMPORAL REALITY AS THEN THE CAUSE FOR REASONING AND
RATIONALITY."

That my mathematical theoretical noumenon defines the meta-descriptor
prototypes which are prerequisite to the BEING of HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] as
EXISTENCE / *OUSIA*.

<http://www.grapple369.com/Grumble.zip> (Download resources)

After all the ENNEAD of THOTH and not the Roman Catholic Eucharist,
expresses an Anthropic Cosmological Principle which appears within its
geometric conception as being equivalent to the Pythagorean
TETRAD/TETRACTYS.

[dolf]

Post by dolf

Post by dolf
Thank you for clarifying the historical facts and answering my question.

I note that the Silk Road enabled trade with Rome which is further west
than Jerusalem.
<< Silk Road, also called Silk Route, ancient trade route, linking China
with the West, that carried goods and ideas between the two great
civilizations of Rome and China. >>
<https://www.britannica.com/topic/Silk-Road-trade-route>

The periapsis occurring on 3 January maps to #314 - magus and with the
canon of supreme mystery tetra #3 to hexagram H3.

If I reference the Dao Te Ching #3 it reads as follows:

"Neglecting to praise the worthy deters people from emulating them,
Not
prizing rare treasures deters a man from becoming a thief,  
Ignoring the
things which awaken desire keeps the heart at rest. 
Therefore the wise
ruler does not suggest unnecessary things, 
He seeks to satisfy the minds
of his people. 
He seeks to allay appetites but strengthen bones. 
He ever
tries by keeping people in ignorance to keep them satisfied 
and those who
have knowledge he restrains from evil. 
If he, himself, practices restraint
then everything is in quietness."
-  Translated by Dwight Goddard and Henri
Borel, 1919, Chapter 3    

<Loading Image...>

Post by dolf

Post by dolf

Post by dolf
The question I have is whether the Asian philosophers were ever regarded as
MAGI as likely to possess : gold, frankincense and myrrh

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_Magi
<< The term refers to the Persian priestly caste of Zoroastrianism. >>

Post by dolf
Especially given Lingbao Tianzun ("Lord of the Numinous Treasure") is
also known as the "Supreme Pure One" (Shàngqing) or
"The Universally Honoured One of Divinities and Treasures"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Pure_Ones
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lingbao_Tianzun
I'm not seeing a reference
specifically to gold, frankincense and myrrh.
The word, ever, as in, ever regarded, has potential.
Wai Tan, External Alchemy, included mercury in cinnabar.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waidan
Gold is mentioned at the above link.
I don't know anything about the other two
being used to change consciousness, philosophically,
metaphysically, or getting stoned along the Way.
http://www.itmonline.org/arts/myrrh.htm
<< In the Chinese medicine books, frankincense was first mentioned in
the Mingyi Bielu (Miscellaneous Records of Famous Physicians; ca. 500
A.D.). It was called fanhunxiang (calling back the soul fragrance) and
ruxiang (nipple-shaped fragrance); the latter name has been retained,
but the former is true to the original use of frankincense as incense
for mourning the dead. Myrrh, already known in China, entered the
formal herb books somewhat later, in the Kaibao Bencao (Materia Medica
of the Kaibao Era, 973 A.D.). Its name, moyao, indicates the medicine
(yao) of mo, the Chinese pronunciation of the Arabic name murr,
meaning bitter. In modern Chinese Materia Medica, these two resins are
classified as herbs for vitalizing circulation of blood and are
utilized for treating traumatic injury, painful swellings, masses, and
other disorders related to stasis syndromes. Their source remains the
Middle East, though frankincense trees have been cultivated in
southern China. >>
<< In these ancient times, myrrh had been used in Egypt for embalming
the bodies of Pharaohs, and frankincense had been used in India to
make incense for worship (in India, a related species of plant is
indigenous, though it produces an inferior product). Myrrh and
frankincense, traded throughout the Middle East at least since 1500
B.C., eventually came to China. There is mention of myrrh in a 4th
century (A.D.) Chinese book that is no longer existent but is quoted
directly in a later text. As in the Middle East, myrrh and
frankincense were used in China for making incense, and are so used
even today. But, in characteristic Chinese fashion of finding a
medicinal use for virtually everything, these herbs were soon employed
as medicines.>>
The Silk Road provided ample opportunity for trade.

Post by dolf
<< The Chinese historian Yu Ying-shi concludes that "as a general term,
fang-shih may be translated 'religious Taoists' or 'popular Taoists,' since
all such arts were later incorporated in the Taoist religion.
Only in specific cases depending on contexts, should the term be translated
'magicians,' 'alchemists,' or 'immortalists.'" Fangshi "is an elusive term
that defies a consistent translation" >>
<https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fangshi>

<< Joseph Needham traced the origins of Daoism to an alliance between
fangshi, wu "shamans; doctors" and philosophers such as Laozi and
At the heart of ancient Taoism there was an artisanal element, for
both the wizards and the philosophers were convinced that important
and useful things could be achieved by using one's hands. They did not
participate in the mentality of the Confucian scholar-administrator,
who sat on high in his tribunal issuing orders and never employing his
hands except in reading and writing. This is why it came about that
wherever in ancient China one finds the sprouts of any of the natural
sciences the Taoists are sure to be involved. The fang shih or
'gentlemen possessing magical recipes' were certainly Taoist, and they
worked in all kinds of directions as star-clerk and
weather-forecasters, men of farm-lore and wort-cunning, irrigators and
bridge-builders, architects and decorators, but above all alchemists.
Indeed the beginning of all alchemy rests with them if we define it,
as surely we should, as the combination of macrobiotics and
aurifaction.[36]
Needham defined his "carefully chosen" words: macrobiotics "the belief
that, with the aid of botany, zoology, mineralogy, and alchemy, it is
possible to prepare drugs or elixirs which will prolong life, giving
longevity (shou) or immortality (pu ssu)" and aurifaction "the belief
that it is possible to make gold from other quite different
substances, notably the ignoble metals".
Csikszentmihalyi summarizes Daoist-fangshi connections,
The "methods" of the fangshi may be seen as forerunners of organized
Taoist practices on several levels. In the Han, the concept of the Dao
served to explain the efficacy of the myriad of newly forming
disciplines, and many of these disciplines were the province of the
fangshi. This explains why the term daoshi (masters of the Dao) was
already beginning to replace the term fangshi in the Hanshu, resulting
in its gradual eclipse of the latter term. On a more concrete level,
many specific techniques of spirit transcendence, medicine, and
alchemy initially used by fangshi found their way
into later Taoist practice. >>
In the Chuang-tzu, shamanism is dealt with in a passage
when Lieh Tzu brought a shaman to his teacher, Hu Tzu.
The shaman did not fare well during the encounter.
I don't recall anything about the fangshi in Tao Chia
so-called Taoist Philosophy as contrasted with
Tao Chiao, Taoist Religion.
To say there was no difference in practice, some scholars do.
Ancient historians appear to have disagreed, coining jargon.
- interesting! Thanks!

--
YOUTUBE: "The Meerkat Circus"

http://youtu.be/H-7OuqWi4vQ

SEE ALSO AS RELATIONSHIP: *INVALIDATING* {Perennial philosophy (HETEROS
{#390 - ROBBERS} v’s HOMOIOS {#391 - STEWARDS OF GOD’S HOUSE} THEORY OF
NUMBER) as universal of right and wrong...} *THE* *ORTHODOX* *AND* *ROMAN*
*CATHOLIC* *CHURCH'S* *CLAIM* {#390 as 1, #100, #80, #1, #3, #5, #200 as
harpax (G727): {#11 as #242} 1) rapacious, ravenous; 2) a extortioner, a
robber} *TO* *JUBILEE2000* *AS* *BEING* *DELUSIONAL* *AND* *FRAUDULENT*

Private Street on the edge of the Central Business District dated 16th May,
2000 - This report is prepared in response to a TP00/55 as a Notice of an
Application for Planning Permit

<http://www.grapple369.com/jubilee2000.html>

SEE ALSO: HYPOSTASIS AS DAO OF NATURE (Chinese: ZIRAN) / COURSE (Greek:
TROCHOS) OF NATURE (Greek: GENESIS) [James 3:6]

Chinese HAN Dynasty (206 BCE - 220CE) Hexagon Trigrams to Tetragram
assignments proposed by Yang Hsiung (53BCE - 18CE) which by 4BCE
(translation published within English as first European language in 1993),
first appeared in draft form as a meta-thesis titled T'AI HSUAN CHING {ie.
Canon of Supreme Mystery} on Natural Divination associated with the theory
of number, annual seasonal chronology and astrology reliant upon the seven
visible planets as cosmological mother image and the zodiac.

It shows the ZIRAN as the DAO of NATURE / COURSE-trochos OF NATURE-genesis
[James 3:6] as HYPOSTASIS comprising #81 trinomial tetragrammaton x 4.5 day
= #364.5 day / year as HOMOIOS THEORY OF NUMBER which is an amalgam of the
64 hexagrams as binomial trigrams / 81 as trinomial tetragrammaton rather
than its encapsulated contrived use as the microcosm to redefine the
macrocosm as the quintessence of the Pythagorean [Babylonian] as binomial
canon of transposition as HETEROS THEORY OF NUMBER.

<http://www.grapple369.com/nature.html>

The Charter of Human Rights and Responsibilities No. 43 of Act 2006 defines
a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING” and the question is, if it is permissible to
extend this definition to be a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING AS A CONSCIOUS
REALITY OF HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] WHO IS INSTANTIATED WITHIN THE TEMPORAL
REALITY AS THEN THE CAUSE FOR REASONING AND RATIONALITY."

That my mathematical theoretical noumenon defines the meta-descriptor
prototypes which are prerequisite to the BEING of HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] as
EXISTENCE / *OUSIA*.

<http://www.grapple369.com/Grumble.zip> (Download resources)

After all the ENNEAD of THOTH and not the Roman Catholic Eucharist,
expresses an Anthropic Cosmological Principle which appears within its
geometric conception as being equivalent to the Pythagorean
TETRAD/TETRACTYS.

[dolf]

Correction

Post by dolf

Post by dolf
Thank you for clarifying the historical facts and answering my question.

I note that the Silk Road enabled trade with Rome which is further west
than Jerusalem.
<< Silk Road, also called Silk Route, ancient trade route, linking China
with the West, that carried goods and ideas between the two great
civilizations of Rome and China. >>
<https://www.britannica.com/topic/Silk-Road-trade-route>

The periapsis occurring on 3 January maps to #314 - magus and with the
canon of supreme mystery tetra #3 to hexagram H3 - BIRTH THROES.

If I reference the Dao Te Ching #3 it reads as follows:

"Neglecting to praise the worthy deters people from emulating them,
Not
prizing rare treasures deters a man from becoming a thief,  
Ignoring the
things which awaken desire keeps the heart at rest. 
Therefore the wise
ruler does not suggest unnecessary things, 
He seeks to satisfy the minds
of his people. 
He seeks to allay appetites but strengthen bones. 
He ever
tries by keeping people in ignorance to keep them satisfied 
and those who
have knowledge he restrains from evil. 
If he, himself, practices restraint
then everything is in quietness."
-  Translated by Dwight Goddard and Henri
Borel, 1919, Chapter 3    

Post by dolf

Post by dolf

Post by dolf
The question I have is whether the Asian philosophers were ever regarded as
MAGI as likely to possess : gold, frankincense and myrrh

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_Magi
<< The term refers to the Persian priestly caste of Zoroastrianism. >>

Post by dolf
Especially given Lingbao Tianzun ("Lord of the Numinous Treasure") is
also known as the "Supreme Pure One" (Shàngqing) or
"The Universally Honoured One of Divinities and Treasures"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Pure_Ones
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lingbao_Tianzun
I'm not seeing a reference
specifically to gold, frankincense and myrrh.
The word, ever, as in, ever regarded, has potential.
Wai Tan, External Alchemy, included mercury in cinnabar.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waidan
Gold is mentioned at the above link.
I don't know anything about the other two
being used to change consciousness, philosophically,
metaphysically, or getting stoned along the Way.
http://www.itmonline.org/arts/myrrh.htm
<< In the Chinese medicine books, frankincense was first mentioned in
the Mingyi Bielu (Miscellaneous Records of Famous Physicians; ca. 500
A.D.). It was called fanhunxiang (calling back the soul fragrance) and
ruxiang (nipple-shaped fragrance); the latter name has been retained,
but the former is true to the original use of frankincense as incense
for mourning the dead. Myrrh, already known in China, entered the
formal herb books somewhat later, in the Kaibao Bencao (Materia Medica
of the Kaibao Era, 973 A.D.). Its name, moyao, indicates the medicine
(yao) of mo, the Chinese pronunciation of the Arabic name murr,
meaning bitter. In modern Chinese Materia Medica, these two resins are
classified as herbs for vitalizing circulation of blood and are
utilized for treating traumatic injury, painful swellings, masses, and
other disorders related to stasis syndromes. Their source remains the
Middle East, though frankincense trees have been cultivated in
southern China. >>
<< In these ancient times, myrrh had been used in Egypt for embalming
the bodies of Pharaohs, and frankincense had been used in India to
make incense for worship (in India, a related species of plant is
indigenous, though it produces an inferior product). Myrrh and
frankincense, traded throughout the Middle East at least since 1500
B.C., eventually came to China. There is mention of myrrh in a 4th
century (A.D.) Chinese book that is no longer existent but is quoted
directly in a later text. As in the Middle East, myrrh and
frankincense were used in China for making incense, and are so used
even today. But, in characteristic Chinese fashion of finding a
medicinal use for virtually everything, these herbs were soon employed
as medicines.>>
The Silk Road provided ample opportunity for trade.

Post by dolf
<< The Chinese historian Yu Ying-shi concludes that "as a general term,
fang-shih may be translated 'religious Taoists' or 'popular Taoists,' since
all such arts were later incorporated in the Taoist religion.
Only in specific cases depending on contexts, should the term be translated
'magicians,' 'alchemists,' or 'immortalists.'" Fangshi "is an elusive term
that defies a consistent translation" >>
<https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fangshi>

<< Joseph Needham traced the origins of Daoism to an alliance between
fangshi, wu "shamans; doctors" and philosophers such as Laozi and
At the heart of ancient Taoism there was an artisanal element, for
both the wizards and the philosophers were convinced that important
and useful things could be achieved by using one's hands. They did not
participate in the mentality of the Confucian scholar-administrator,
who sat on high in his tribunal issuing orders and never employing his
hands except in reading and writing. This is why it came about that
wherever in ancient China one finds the sprouts of any of the natural
sciences the Taoists are sure to be involved. The fang shih or
'gentlemen possessing magical recipes' were certainly Taoist, and they
worked in all kinds of directions as star-clerk and
weather-forecasters, men of farm-lore and wort-cunning, irrigators and
bridge-builders, architects and decorators, but above all alchemists.
Indeed the beginning of all alchemy rests with them if we define it,
as surely we should, as the combination of macrobiotics and
aurifaction.[36]
Needham defined his "carefully chosen" words: macrobiotics "the belief
that, with the aid of botany, zoology, mineralogy, and alchemy, it is
possible to prepare drugs or elixirs which will prolong life, giving
longevity (shou) or immortality (pu ssu)" and aurifaction "the belief
that it is possible to make gold from other quite different
substances, notably the ignoble metals".
Csikszentmihalyi summarizes Daoist-fangshi connections,
The "methods" of the fangshi may be seen as forerunners of organized
Taoist practices on several levels. In the Han, the concept of the Dao
served to explain the efficacy of the myriad of newly forming
disciplines, and many of these disciplines were the province of the
fangshi. This explains why the term daoshi (masters of the Dao) was
already beginning to replace the term fangshi in the Hanshu, resulting
in its gradual eclipse of the latter term. On a more concrete level,
many specific techniques of spirit transcendence, medicine, and
alchemy initially used by fangshi found their way
into later Taoist practice. >>
In the Chuang-tzu, shamanism is dealt with in a passage
when Lieh Tzu brought a shaman to his teacher, Hu Tzu.
The shaman did not fare well during the encounter.
I don't recall anything about the fangshi in Tao Chia
so-called Taoist Philosophy as contrasted with
Tao Chiao, Taoist Religion.
To say there was no difference in practice, some scholars do.
Ancient historians appear to have disagreed, coining jargon.
- interesting! Thanks!

--
YOUTUBE: "The Meerkat Circus"

http://youtu.be/H-7OuqWi4vQ

SEE ALSO AS RELATIONSHIP: *INVALIDATING* {Perennial philosophy (HETEROS
{#390 - ROBBERS} v’s HOMOIOS {#391 - STEWARDS OF GOD’S HOUSE} THEORY OF
NUMBER) as universal of right and wrong...} *THE* *ORTHODOX* *AND* *ROMAN*
*CATHOLIC* *CHURCH'S* *CLAIM* {#390 as 1, #100, #80, #1, #3, #5, #200 as
harpax (G727): {#11 as #242} 1) rapacious, ravenous; 2) a extortioner, a
robber} *TO* *JUBILEE2000* *AS* *BEING* *DELUSIONAL* *AND* *FRAUDULENT*

Private Street on the edge of the Central Business District dated 16th May,
2000 - This report is prepared in response to a TP00/55 as a Notice of an
Application for Planning Permit

<http://www.grapple369.com/jubilee2000.html>

SEE ALSO: HYPOSTASIS AS DAO OF NATURE (Chinese: ZIRAN) / COURSE (Greek:
TROCHOS) OF NATURE (Greek: GENESIS) [James 3:6]

Chinese HAN Dynasty (206 BCE - 220CE) Hexagon Trigrams to Tetragram
assignments proposed by Yang Hsiung (53BCE - 18CE) which by 4BCE
(translation published within English as first European language in 1993),
first appeared in draft form as a meta-thesis titled T'AI HSUAN CHING {ie.
Canon of Supreme Mystery} on Natural Divination associated with the theory
of number, annual seasonal chronology and astrology reliant upon the seven
visible planets as cosmological mother image and the zodiac.

It shows the ZIRAN as the DAO of NATURE / COURSE-trochos OF NATURE-genesis
[James 3:6] as HYPOSTASIS comprising #81 trinomial tetragrammaton x 4.5 day
= #364.5 day / year as HOMOIOS THEORY OF NUMBER which is an amalgam of the
64 hexagrams as binomial trigrams / 81 as trinomial tetragrammaton rather
than its encapsulated contrived use as the microcosm to redefine the
macrocosm as the quintessence of the Pythagorean [Babylonian] as binomial
canon of transposition as HETEROS THEORY OF NUMBER.

<http://www.grapple369.com/nature.html>

The Charter of Human Rights and Responsibilities No. 43 of Act 2006 defines
a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING” and the question is, if it is permissible to
extend this definition to be a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING AS A CONSCIOUS
REALITY OF HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] WHO IS INSTANTIATED WITHIN THE TEMPORAL
REALITY AS THEN THE CAUSE FOR REASONING AND RATIONALITY."

That my mathematical theoretical noumenon defines the meta-descriptor
prototypes which are prerequisite to the BEING of HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] as
EXISTENCE / *OUSIA*.

<http://www.grapple369.com/Grumble.zip> (Download resources)

After all the ENNEAD of THOTH and not the Roman Catholic Eucharist,
expresses an Anthropic Cosmological Principle which appears within its
geometric conception as being equivalent to the Pythagorean
TETRAD/TETRACTYS.

[dolf]

Frankincense Essential Oil is known as the best essential oils for bone
healing.

You didn’t comment on the notion that the Silk Road trading route passed
through to Persia.

Post by dolf

Post by dolf
Thank you for clarifying the historical facts and answering my question.

I note that the Silk Road enabled trade with Rome which is further west
than Jerusalem.
<< Silk Road, also called Silk Route, ancient trade route, linking China
with the West, that carried goods and ideas between the two great
civilizations of Rome and China. >>
<https://www.britannica.com/topic/Silk-Road-trade-route>

The periapsis occurring on 3 January maps to #314 - magus and with the
canon of supreme mystery tetra #3 to hexagram H3 - BIRTH THROES.
"Neglecting to praise the worthy deters people from emulating them,

Not prizing rare treasures deters a man from becoming a thief, 

Ignoring the things which awaken desire keeps the heart at rest.

Therefore the wise ruler does not suggest unnecessary things,

He seeks to satisfy the minds of his people. 

He seeks to allay appetites but strengthen bones.

He ever tries by keeping people in ignorance to keep them satisfied

and those who have knowledge he restrains from evil.

If he, himself, practices restraint then everything is in quietness."
- 
Translated by Dwight Goddard and Henri Borel, 1919, Chapter 3    
<https://www.grapple369.com/images/EarthSeasons.png>

Post by dolf

Post by dolf

Post by dolf
The question I have is whether the Asian philosophers were ever regarded as
MAGI as likely to possess : gold, frankincense and myrrh

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_Magi
<< The term refers to the Persian priestly caste of Zoroastrianism. >>

Post by dolf
Especially given Lingbao Tianzun ("Lord of the Numinous Treasure") is
also known as the "Supreme Pure One" (Shàngqing) or
"The Universally Honoured One of Divinities and Treasures"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Pure_Ones
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lingbao_Tianzun
I'm not seeing a reference
specifically to gold, frankincense and myrrh.
The word, ever, as in, ever regarded, has potential.
Wai Tan, External Alchemy, included mercury in cinnabar.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waidan
Gold is mentioned at the above link.
I don't know anything about the other two
being used to change consciousness, philosophically,
metaphysically, or getting stoned along the Way.
http://www.itmonline.org/arts/myrrh.htm
<< In the Chinese medicine books, frankincense was first mentioned in
the Mingyi Bielu (Miscellaneous Records of Famous Physicians; ca. 500
A.D.). It was called fanhunxiang (calling back the soul fragrance) and
ruxiang (nipple-shaped fragrance); the latter name has been retained,
but the former is true to the original use of frankincense as incense
for mourning the dead. Myrrh, already known in China, entered the
formal herb books somewhat later, in the Kaibao Bencao (Materia Medica
of the Kaibao Era, 973 A.D.). Its name, moyao, indicates the medicine
(yao) of mo, the Chinese pronunciation of the Arabic name murr,
meaning bitter. In modern Chinese Materia Medica, these two resins are
classified as herbs for vitalizing circulation of blood and are
utilized for treating traumatic injury, painful swellings, masses, and
other disorders related to stasis syndromes. Their source remains the
Middle East, though frankincense trees have been cultivated in
southern China. >>
<< In these ancient times, myrrh had been used in Egypt for embalming
the bodies of Pharaohs, and frankincense had been used in India to
make incense for worship (in India, a related species of plant is
indigenous, though it produces an inferior product). Myrrh and
frankincense, traded throughout the Middle East at least since 1500
B.C., eventually came to China. There is mention of myrrh in a 4th
century (A.D.) Chinese book that is no longer existent but is quoted
directly in a later text. As in the Middle East, myrrh and
frankincense were used in China for making incense, and are so used
even today. But, in characteristic Chinese fashion of finding a
medicinal use for virtually everything, these herbs were soon employed
as medicines.>>
The Silk Road provided ample opportunity for trade.

Post by dolf
<< The Chinese historian Yu Ying-shi concludes that "as a general term,
fang-shih may be translated 'religious Taoists' or 'popular Taoists,' since
all such arts were later incorporated in the Taoist religion.
Only in specific cases depending on contexts, should the term be translated
'magicians,' 'alchemists,' or 'immortalists.'" Fangshi "is an elusive term
that defies a consistent translation" >>
<https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fangshi>

<< Joseph Needham traced the origins of Daoism to an alliance between
fangshi, wu "shamans; doctors" and philosophers such as Laozi and
At the heart of ancient Taoism there was an artisanal element, for
both the wizards and the philosophers were convinced that important
and useful things could be achieved by using one's hands. They did not
participate in the mentality of the Confucian scholar-administrator,
who sat on high in his tribunal issuing orders and never employing his
hands except in reading and writing. This is why it came about that
wherever in ancient China one finds the sprouts of any of the natural
sciences the Taoists are sure to be involved. The fang shih or
'gentlemen possessing magical recipes' were certainly Taoist, and they
worked in all kinds of directions as star-clerk and
weather-forecasters, men of farm-lore and wort-cunning, irrigators and
bridge-builders, architects and decorators, but above all alchemists.
Indeed the beginning of all alchemy rests with them if we define it,
as surely we should, as the combination of macrobiotics and
aurifaction.[36]
Needham defined his "carefully chosen" words: macrobiotics "the belief
that, with the aid of botany, zoology, mineralogy, and alchemy, it is
possible to prepare drugs or elixirs which will prolong life, giving
longevity (shou) or immortality (pu ssu)" and aurifaction "the belief
that it is possible to make gold from other quite different
substances, notably the ignoble metals".
Csikszentmihalyi summarizes Daoist-fangshi connections,
The "methods" of the fangshi may be seen as forerunners of organized
Taoist practices on several levels. In the Han, the concept of the Dao
served to explain the efficacy of the myriad of newly forming
disciplines, and many of these disciplines were the province of the
fangshi. This explains why the term daoshi (masters of the Dao) was
already beginning to replace the term fangshi in the Hanshu, resulting
in its gradual eclipse of the latter term. On a more concrete level,
many specific techniques of spirit transcendence, medicine, and
alchemy initially used by fangshi found their way
into later Taoist practice. >>
In the Chuang-tzu, shamanism is dealt with in a passage
when Lieh Tzu brought a shaman to his teacher, Hu Tzu.
The shaman did not fare well during the encounter.
I don't recall anything about the fangshi in Tao Chia
so-called Taoist Philosophy as contrasted with
Tao Chiao, Taoist Religion.
To say there was no difference in practice, some scholars do.
Ancient historians appear to have disagreed, coining jargon.
- interesting! Thanks!

--
YOUTUBE: "The Meerkat Circus"

http://youtu.be/H-7OuqWi4vQ

SEE ALSO AS RELATIONSHIP: *INVALIDATING* {Perennial philosophy (HETEROS
{#390 - ROBBERS} v’s HOMOIOS {#391 - STEWARDS OF GOD’S HOUSE} THEORY OF
NUMBER) as universal of right and wrong...} *THE* *ORTHODOX* *AND* *ROMAN*
*CATHOLIC* *CHURCH'S* *CLAIM* {#390 as 1, #100, #80, #1, #3, #5, #200 as
harpax (G727): {#11 as #242} 1) rapacious, ravenous; 2) a extortioner, a
robber} *TO* *JUBILEE2000* *AS* *BEING* *DELUSIONAL* *AND* *FRAUDULENT*

Private Street on the edge of the Central Business District dated 16th May,
2000 - This report is prepared in response to a TP00/55 as a Notice of an
Application for Planning Permit

<http://www.grapple369.com/jubilee2000.html>

SEE ALSO: HYPOSTASIS AS DAO OF NATURE (Chinese: ZIRAN) / COURSE (Greek:
TROCHOS) OF NATURE (Greek: GENESIS) [James 3:6]

Chinese HAN Dynasty (206 BCE - 220CE) Hexagon Trigrams to Tetragram
assignments proposed by Yang Hsiung (53BCE - 18CE) which by 4BCE
(translation published within English as first European language in 1993),
first appeared in draft form as a meta-thesis titled T'AI HSUAN CHING {ie.
Canon of Supreme Mystery} on Natural Divination associated with the theory
of number, annual seasonal chronology and astrology reliant upon the seven
visible planets as cosmological mother image and the zodiac.

It shows the ZIRAN as the DAO of NATURE / COURSE-trochos OF NATURE-genesis
[James 3:6] as HYPOSTASIS comprising #81 trinomial tetragrammaton x 4.5 day
= #364.5 day / year as HOMOIOS THEORY OF NUMBER which is an amalgam of the
64 hexagrams as binomial trigrams / 81 as trinomial tetragrammaton rather
than its encapsulated contrived use as the microcosm to redefine the
macrocosm as the quintessence of the Pythagorean [Babylonian] as binomial
canon of transposition as HETEROS THEORY OF NUMBER.

<http://www.grapple369.com/nature.html>

The Charter of Human Rights and Responsibilities No. 43 of Act 2006 defines
a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING” and the question is, if it is permissible to
extend this definition to be a "PERSON MEANS A HUMAN BEING AS A CONSCIOUS
REALITY OF HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] WHO IS INSTANTIATED WITHIN THE TEMPORAL
REALITY AS THEN THE CAUSE FOR REASONING AND RATIONALITY."

That my mathematical theoretical noumenon defines the meta-descriptor
prototypes which are prerequisite to the BEING of HOMO[iOS] SAPIEN[T] as
EXISTENCE / *OUSIA*.

<http://www.grapple369.com/Grumble.zip> (Download resources)

After all the ENNEAD of THOTH and not the Roman Catholic Eucharist,
expresses an Anthropic Cosmological Principle which appears within its
geometric conception as being equivalent to the Pythagorean
TETRAD/TETRACTYS.